Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,002
# 81
10-21-2012, 04:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by allocater View Post
And one more thing:

Just the act of converting an EDC/salvage/token into the equipment you want feels like: "Yes, I am getting my reward. I am turning this stuff in for the reward. I am cashing in (or out)? I have a net benefit. I am being rewarded."

Buying the equip you want with dilithium feels like: "I am paying and I am getting something, I lose something and I gain something. It's a trade-off. I could have gotten something else with that dilithium. Why am I paying here? Did I not earn it with beating STFs? Was it all for nothing? Maybe I shouldn't have. What am I doing?"

A little exaggerated, but anyways
VERY exaggerated......
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnny111971 View Post
Well said... I am personally glad that the "luck" factor is out of the STF. How many have completed 200-300 missions without complete sets?

Now there is a set goal... you know when you'll reach it... not have to rely on the roll of the dice.
Yeah, LUCK is the reason I never bothered with Elites. Play a really hard mission for 30 mins and get 2 EDC and MAYBE an item I can sell on exchange? No thank you. With the new system I know what I'll get ahead of time.

And as for the dil costs of stuff..... how often are you planning to buy it? Probably not once a day.....
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Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 477
# 82
10-21-2012, 04:37 AM
I only have one Fed toon and one KDF toon (I rarely use, yet sumhow got all purrtotype set gear with that one), and now I'm glad I didn't do that multiple toon thingy lots of others did. Because now it seems that having just one toon per faction works in my favor.
"Everything about the Jham'Hadar is lethal!" - Eris
Original Join Date: January 30th, 2010
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,874
# 83
10-21-2012, 07:17 AM
Just a note, AFAIK, only the Elite Omega marks are supposed to be exchangable for dil, not the normal Omega marks (that you'll get by the hundreds, after few STFs).

No, overall, STFs are now gonna be just ways of getting STF loot, nothing more. Now you get dilithium out of them AND some loot.

And most of the versatility of current EDCs is lost in the process. Now you are sure to get EDCs --> those can buy you up to Mk XI weapons, equipment, dilithium, ground and space sets and some not that great doffs.

The (regular) Omega marks are only usable as an input in the rep system. And only by giving other ressources in addition to them to that system, you can get that same things again (sure, with new additons).
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix: Bring in the Allegiance class
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia: Design that long overdue Tier 5 C-Store Raptor
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var: Give us Asylums for Romulans

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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 855
# 84
10-21-2012, 09:29 AM
One thing Cryptic should take from Blizzard, is making the Reputation System, ACCOUNT WIDE. Pain in the ass having to level the Reputation System on 1 character, let alone several characters. And yes, at this point i'm fairly certain there are quite a few players who have multiple characters.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 170
# 85
10-21-2012, 10:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
You mean except for that crazy idea like a virtual store where you can buy virtual goods right?


The rage you are seeing is that people are now being asked to pay, by current dilithium prices, around $18.75 for 8 borg weapons and a full STF space set. (roughly 300k dil / 160 dil per zen price).

For one character.


Since we seem to be losing sources of dilithium, and having more dilithium taxes applied to the game - I think it will make dilithium vs. zen even stronger than it is now.

Raising the price of gearing one character accordingly.



There is a point where attaching a dilithium tax to everything endgame is going to backfire imo, and while we may not be there yet - it's starting to feel like we are getting close.
Dont know about you. But unless season seven is pushed backward to January and everything is taken off the board and started over from with? Yeah. The day season 7 launches i'll read the patch notes... and there's a 70% chance i'll hit the uninstall button never to be seen on these forums and in game again. I for one AM at that point.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 760
# 86
10-21-2012, 07:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by weylandjuarez View Post
I've earned complete Mk XI and Mk XII sets of both Omega, MACO and KHG for most of my ships and characters (and Boffs). The only way - the only way I'd be happy with this change is if I went into Season 7 with the Omega rep system completely unlocked for my characters whilst retaining the Dilithium and/or purchasing value of all the unspent Borg currency I have.

Anything less is cheating me out of the considerable time I've invested in getting my characters where they are.
+1


Quote:
Originally Posted by djnooob View Post
What about veterans
- I haven't been playing that long but in the time I have been here I've put a lot of hours into the game. I'm currently sitting on nearly 400 edc's on one toon. Now you're going to turn around and ask those of use who have put in the time already to go and grind again just to have privledge to spend our dil on something in reality we've already earned the right to get?
Agreed. I'm sitting on 500+ EDC, almost 100 proto salvage, 40 rare salvage and about 5 of each type of proto tech drop. That's raw currency I can convert into gear right now. If I get a new ship or want to change load out, I can fit it out right now by visiting roxy and turning in the required bits.

Alternatively if I don't have much play time on a particular day, I can login, visit roxy and convert some salvage directly into dilithium ore, click refine and be done for the day.

With this upcoming conversion, this unconverted gear/dilithium I currently own will be taken away and be used to unlock a new store? A store that requires dilithium to get anything out of(?), which they effectively just took away from me to unlock the STF store?

I think I worked it out in another thread but I have at least 310k worth of dilithium in EDC/salvage/tech. What's that worth in zen points? Not sure of current conversion rate but thats gotta be around or over 2500 zen, $25.

If I can't get that equivalent amount OUT of the new system after the conversion, then Cryptic have essentially stolen my money.

Granted we don't have the full details yet, but if there's any loss in the conversion like there was with the previous conversion Cryptic did with exploration marks etc (after a certain converted amount your stuff converts into less), they are effectively taking money without consent.

That may have been ok with explore marks that in and of themselves weren't worth anything monetarily, but STF EDC/salvage/tech is worth actual money, and I'm worried about what they will be taking from me.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 145
# 87 ty
10-21-2012, 07:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borticuscryptic View Post
If you hold onto them, they will be automatically replaced with an amount of Omega Marks when Season 7 goes live.

A dev blog giving more information on the conversion will be surfacing soon. I'd wait until you've read that before making a decision on whether to cash out now, or wait for the conversion.

Thanks for informing us and answering questions.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 248
# 88
10-21-2012, 07:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by meurik View Post
One thing Cryptic should take from Blizzard, is making the Reputation System, ACCOUNT WIDE. Pain in the ass having to level the Reputation System on 1 character, let alone several characters. And yes, at this point i'm fairly certain there are quite a few players who have multiple characters.
Meurk, I'm not sure I agree with you on that point. I think part of the problem is the use of the term "reputation," which causes a completely reasonable comparison with WOW and other games with similar systems.

The STO reputation system strikes me as being a lot closer in intent (if smaller in scope) than the alternate advancement system that Everquest uses (more info: http://everquest.allakhazam.com/wiki/eq:AA). This in turn goes back to the Demihuman max-level advancement system from the original pen and paper D&D. In both cases, the purpose of the system is to allow max-level characters to continue to develop and grow without actually adding more levels to the game.

This is fundamentally a character-level activity. Making it account-based would undermine its value as a gameplay extender for 50th level characters, since each player would only go through the advancement cycle once.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,020
# 89
10-21-2012, 08:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ashtaku View Post
This is fundamentally a character-level activity. Making it account-based would undermine its value as a gameplay extender for 50th level characters, since each player would only go through the advancement cycle once.
Except it has no value as a 'gameplay' extender - it's merely another dilithium store that you can't actually shop in until you've run 50-odd STFs, paid Dilithium, Doffs and other resources and waited around for a month or two.

The only 'gameplay' that's present in this system is some weak-sauce passive skills at the lower Tiers and a couple of interesting ones at Tier 4 and 5.

It also strikes me that this is the first push to eliminate rewards altogether from story content - things like the Featured Episodes Jem'hadar set - instead of playing missions for the cool loot, you'll be playing them for marks to unlock a Jem'hadar Dilithium store etc.

You have noticed that the both the Reman Covariant Shield Array and the Borg Console are in the reputation system? Right now you can you can play an interesting mission like Coliseum or Assimilation and earn a nifty reward for it - after Season 7 all you'll get is Romulan or Omega Marks and if you want a reward you're damn well gonna have to pay for it...

Can anyone tell me exactly, where's the incentive to play?
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,540
# 90
10-21-2012, 09:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by weylandjuarez View Post
Except it has no value as a 'gameplay' extender - it's merely another dilithium store that you can't actually shop in until you've run 50-odd STFs, paid Dilithium, Doffs and other resources and waited around for a month or two.

The only 'gameplay' that's present in this system is some weak-sauce passive skills at the lower Tiers and a couple of interesting ones at Tier 4 and 5.

It also strikes me that this is the first push to eliminate rewards altogether from story content - things like the Featured Episodes Jem'hadar set - instead of playing missions for the cool loot, you'll be playing them for marks to unlock a Jem'hadar Dilithium store etc.

You have noticed that the both the Reman Covariant Shield Array and the Borg Console are in the reputation system? Right now you can you can play an interesting mission like Coliseum or Assimilation and earn a nifty reward for it - after Season 7 all you'll get is Romulan or Omega Marks and if you want a reward you're damn well gonna have to pay for it...

Can anyone tell me exactly, where's the incentive to play?
It extends gameplay by delaying it and encouraging repetition.

And if you want to take the WoW model for rep, it's:

Get to at least T4 on any alt. Rep gains are doubled on any alts.
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