Lieutenant
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 40
# 1 New guy, some observations.
10-29-2012, 05:57 PM
Ok, I'm not exactly 'new', but pretty much. I've been putting off this post until such a time as I got a good handle on all elements of the game, which due to being an avid reader and asker of questions only took a couple of months.

First thing, and this is probably going to raise some hackles but, I have never encountered a community that whines as much as this one does. No matter what happens..added, changed, taken away, modified, tweaked, or even any indication any of these things may or may not happen on any indefinite timescale there is always flowing behind it a figurative river of tears and but hurt. As a guy that's never done the MMO thing before, I am not sure if this is par for the course or not, but it's highly amusing to me.

Second, the game is fantastic, and the community mostly agreeable. The only real 'spam' you get is from people trying to fill their fleets, but I quickly learned to avoid these sorts. I eventually found a fleet that is more interested in doing things and swapping info than hoping the 20 strangers they just enlisted into the fleet might drop a fleet mark or two towards some project before going on their way. All good.

The missions are fun for a run through, and the fact you don't have to repeat them if you don't want to once you've seen the content is spiffy if you ask me. The endgame pve and missions are also pretty cool, especially the elite stfs. It was a real challenge figuring out how to do them on my own(the space ones anyway, the ground ones just take too damn long ), and now its all about getting those optionals(when playing with fleet mates anyway, don't even get me started on pugs)

The space pvp is cool. I am a little confused(though less so every day) still why nobody does it, generally hiding behind excuses like it is dominated by minmaxing superships but I think perhaps some just haven't figured out how to fly their own ships. I pvp all the time and generally do quite well, despite being a new face. (dropping 25 bucks on a brel didn't hurt)

And super excited about season 7.

All in all, keep up the good work devs.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 131
# 2
10-29-2012, 06:17 PM
Quote:
First thing, and this is probably going to raise some hackles but, I have never encountered a community that whines as much as this one does. No matter what happens..added, changed, taken away, modified, tweaked, or even any indication any of these things may or may not happen on any indefinite timescale there is always flowing behind it a figurative river of tears and but hurt. As a guy that's never done the MMO thing before, I am not sure if this is par for the course or not, but it's highly amusing to me.
I agree with you here. As far as it being Par for the course with an MMO, it isnt.
I have been with many different MMO communities and games, and I dont see near as much whining / crying as i do here. Just head over to WoW, EvE, World of Tanks, and other forums and see for yourself. I think what it is mostly, is when this game was in beta, cryptic encouraged ideas and built from that. However, this game is no longer in Beta, and i think alot of people got used to thinking that they can tell cryptic what to do.
Or, they just missed the fact the game has launched, and is no longer in Beta.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 335
# 3
10-29-2012, 06:22 PM
I agree with you on the whining(I'm guilty of some of it to) but what I see a lot in every thread is when someone postes a idea and then people start beating up the guy. I'm about done with the forums my self, just cannot take it anymore.

Some of the stuff people say to beat up the original post is just pointless.

Also some people cannot accept lock boxes(now that i realize their not that annoying)

By the way not everyone is this way, it's just a hand full, but it is enough to get me to stop using forums.

Last edited by startrek1234567; 10-29-2012 at 06:29 PM.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,537
# 4
10-29-2012, 06:27 PM
MMO communities are a special kind of fanrage that's matched only by comic books. STO's up there, but not even the worst one, we generally avoid the "not invented here therefore bad" rage that keeps a lot of the old lingering MMOs from doing anything new, but we do have a lot of can't win/can't break even/can't quit playing going on (No change is bad, any change is bad, and change people actually asked for is worst of all).
Lieutenant
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 69
# 5
10-29-2012, 06:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by autodiabolic View Post
First thing, and this is probably going to raise some hackles but, I have never encountered a community that whines as much as this one does.
Maybe if you whine about other people whining it will help the situation. Or...it just makes you a whiner too. So welcome to the QQmunity!
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 914
# 6
10-29-2012, 06:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackdonner View Post
I agree with you here. As far as it being Par for the course with an MMO, it isnt.
I have been with many different MMO communities and games, and I dont see near as much whining / crying as i do here. Just head over to WoW, EvE, World of Tanks, and other forums and see for yourself.
Your a lucky one then, as I stopped using the WOW forums due to the constant whining threads in it.

EvE, the only real whining posts I ever came across there were when someone went out to 0.0 space (PvP for those who do not know what that is) to mine / set up camp etc.. and got blown up, then they went to the forums to moan they got blown up in 0.0 while minding their own business. Those posts always made me laugh. Plus, the odd post about how much you lose if/when you do get blown up, in the early days of EvE there quite a few of those, but not so many when I quit playing.

WoT I cannot comment on as I do not use its forums.

PlanetSide was worse than STO for this, n00b hammer this, lasher spam that, oh the list when on and on... then core combat - ouch, that was brutal on the forums.

So, all in all, the answer to the OP is yes, in MMOs whining posts are part of the game.

And I can tell you why, people have passion for the games they play (more so with Star Trek fans) and when they see something they think does not suit the genre of the game or the style of the game, then people will become vocal about it, as they are trying to protect what is important to them - the game.

I have my own idea what Star Trek is, it has a special meaning to me and is important to me, however, YOUR idea of Star Trek could be very different to mine, so if they change something which I see as the game moving closer to what I know as Star Trek, to you that same change could be moving it away for what you call Star Trek. The only way to protect your beloved idea is to tell the people who make the game what they are doing to it and how they are moving away from your vision of the game.

Alas, as it is Star Trek, it has a lot of fans, with a lot of views and we all have our own reasons as to what we love about the IP, and our views on what makes a Star Trek game true to the IP... so you are going to get some "explosive" (for lack of a better word) conversations here as the game updates and changes (as all MMOs do).

For some, the updates bring them closer to the IP and immerse them even more in the realm of Star Trek, for others it breaks the immersion and ruins the game.
Which one will you be?


Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 688
# 7
10-29-2012, 08:29 PM
The problem is the IP, in a way. If STO didn't have the Star Trek label on it, you wouldn't see so much complaining on the forum, as Star Trek fans who saw something they didn't like would do what the contra-whiners regularly advocate: Pack up and get the hell out.

It's not merely the clashing ideas of what Star Trek is supposed to be, that's barely even the tip of the iceberg, but all other grievances paired with an unwillingness to go somewhere else cause of that brand is what makes the forum into the noisy place it is. Now whether in the absence of that brand fanrage/loyalty the leavers would kill the game, can be argued for and against. It could very well be that without the rules and baggage of Star Trek, Cryptic might've made a more successfull game out of Star Champions Online, or it might've gone the way of Tabula Rasa a long time ago. (It did not launch in the best of conditions.)

That said, the only thing less productive than starting a thread to whine on the forums, has to be starting a thread about whining on the forums.
Reave
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 989
# 8
10-29-2012, 09:14 PM
Whining about the community whining is probably not a good way to introduce yourself to the community, OP.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,537
# 9
10-29-2012, 09:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by autodiabolic View Post
Ok, I'm not exactly 'new', but pretty much. I've been putting off this post until such a time as I got a good handle on all elements of the game, which due to being an avid reader and asker of questions only took a couple of months.

First thing, and this is probably going to raise some hackles but, I have never encountered a community that whines as much as this one does. No matter what happens..added, changed, taken away, modified, tweaked, or even any indication any of these things may or may not happen on any indefinite timescale there is always flowing behind it a figurative river of tears and but hurt. As a guy that's never done the MMO thing before, I am not sure if this is par for the course or not, but it's highly amusing to me.

Second, the game is fantastic, and the community mostly agreeable. The only real 'spam' you get is from people trying to fill their fleets, but I quickly learned to avoid these sorts. I eventually found a fleet that is more interested in doing things and swapping info than hoping the 20 strangers they just enlisted into the fleet might drop a fleet mark or two towards some project before going on their way. All good.

The missions are fun for a run through, and the fact you don't have to repeat them if you don't want to once you've seen the content is spiffy if you ask me. The endgame pve and missions are also pretty cool, especially the elite stfs. It was a real challenge figuring out how to do them on my own(the space ones anyway, the ground ones just take too damn long ), and now its all about getting those optionals(when playing with fleet mates anyway, don't even get me started on pugs)

The space pvp is cool. I am a little confused(though less so every day) still why nobody does it, generally hiding behind excuses like it is dominated by minmaxing superships but I think perhaps some just haven't figured out how to fly their own ships. I pvp all the time and generally do quite well, despite being a new face. (dropping 25 bucks on a brel didn't hurt)
You are right in that there is a lot of whining on these forums, but not all of it is pure whining either. There tends to be a rather good amount of honest, constructive thoughts and ideas a good part of the time though as well.

This is nothing though compared to *********. I played that a long long time ago, and it doesn't matter what it was, there would be heaps of people complaining about any little change, no matter what it was. The PvPers in this game might seem like whiners to some, but they do give real feedback. Players in RS, would have whole groups of people log out all at once, just to cause server havoc, and would complain and complain and complain on the forums. Or in short, they acted like complete children.

So yes, there's whining here, we're all guilty of it, but it's far, far from being as bad as it is elsewhere.

Going on PvP though, there's more or less these kinds in there:

1. Pugs who have no clue what they are doing, or believe that they have an 'end all build' and wanna Kirk it out.
2. Better players, like yourself, who might not be majorly good at it, but better than the Kirks.
3. AFKers.
4. Minmaxxed PvPers (sometimes whole teams) who know every little bit about the game mechanics and how to use them to their complete advantage.

That's some broad generalizations of course, and it's not meant to insult those who do enjoy PvP (I do personally). People though, more don't do it because of all the various 'OP' or 'P2W' things that are in the game. Be it related to DOFFs, consoles, ships, etc.

Lieutenant
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 69
# 10
10-29-2012, 09:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by purplegamer View Post
Whining about the community whining is probably not a good way to introduce yourself to the community, OP.
Cant you see? He's trying to tell us he's one of us
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