Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,073
# 141
11-01-2012, 02:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by eagledraco View Post
Vesta looks awesome sauce. But for the longest Cryptic has straggled the fence with making something great and fun for PvE (which will be great for sales) vs. imbalance in PvP.

You guys really need to consider creating a separate damage and ability system for PvP that is independent of what ship and equipment you use. That way the majority can have fun with their new toys without worrying much about nerfs. And PvP'ers will finally have a permanently balanced system that is isolated from "FOTM", "OP", etc.
Wrong, balance is balance, either on PVP or PVE. All ship needs to be viable on both areas!

And btw cryptic, you guys didn't take my money with the Ody, the lockbox ships, and you are NOT going to take my money with this OP beast. You loss your chance with the useless Sove rift.

Good luck next time.

__________________________________________________

Division Hispana
www.divisionhispana.com
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,703
# 142
11-01-2012, 02:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwebranflakes View Post
Basically, the trolling and harassing has to stop -- it's not good for the community, and it really doesn't help the cause.

...We (the players, the STO team, Cryptic and Perfect World) want it to be a great experience. We've got some ways to go, but if we all work together, I think we can get to a point where PvP is something we'll see more players wanting to participate in.

There's a great discussion going on right now about the Runabouts with those who are testing the Vesta. Some REALLY good feedback coming in that may even help bring a couple changes to how they work.
That is just great. Brandon, this ZINGleet feedback about the friggin runabouts has been screamed up Cryptic's ears since the release of the Atrox. Instead of doing something about it, the Devs in their infinite wisdom made them even stronger and more annoying. Oh yes and release escorts, fed carriers, and now OP Vesta, to make sure that there are plenty of them to go around. Oh yes there are also more annoying fleet version of them. Brilliant response to the univocal feedback you have been getting. I'm not even sure in which universes Cryptic thinks it deserves some recognition for this.

Yes, I read the redshirt patchnotes, but sorry the stats of the Vesta invalidate anything you are doing there. How long have BFI doffs and SNB doffs in game, right the start of S5. How long are we complaining about them, right since release. What have you done with our great feedback, slightly nerfed SNB doffs, and then swamped the market with them so they become even more of a problem. Since there are more to go around now, lets just make sure to boost them back up again, like we did with RSP, hi maybe we get some spike in respec purchases out of it.

I m sorry Brandon, its cryptic trolling and harassing the PvP'ers. Our mostly friendly barter on the forums is not the problem. Just another way to misdirect attention from the real problem. More players becoming aware of the neglect, broken promises, and sheer incompetence of the Systems team when it comes to anything PvP related (don't get me started on lolground). That is the problem. Incompetence is the right word here, since they can't even test 5 men team play with their QnA team according to their statements here on the forum. They have zero experience according to their own statement with it. This is not harassing Devs, it is what "incompetence" means.

"Judge me by my record, DStahl" well there you have it. This new-speech about the great feedback, that subsequently gets completely ignored (FM for PvP, Leaderboards, Siphons, SPam), broken promises (we'll fix cloak, we'll fix Kerrat -> as intended), is really pushing it.

For the record, who was it that started the whole "inconvenient truths" about pvp in these forums. Right, that was Gozer, at the time a Dev.

To be clear: the evil forum pvp'ers are not what newbies need protection from. (less then 1% of 2% of players). Learning just how badly broken, imbalanced, and nonsensical most of the contributions of the systems team have been since Season 1.2 is what Cryptic should be ashamed off.
Joined 06.10
PvP 2010-2011
PvP 2012-2013

Last edited by havam; 11-01-2012 at 03:46 AM.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,202
# 143
11-01-2012, 03:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwebranflakes View Post
There's a great discussion going on right now about the Runabouts with those who are testing the Vesta. Some REALLY good feedback coming in that may even help bring a couple changes to how they work. Everything is still in discussion, so I won't say anything further than that.
There's a bit too much new features on this ship. It's not only runabouts, it's about aux cannons, sci ship with DHCs, 3 new consoles... With the existing consoles and stuff, it'll get soon out of control if you guys keep releasing new equipment at such a rate, because I'm sure you don't test every single possible combo - and we can find new dirty ones with every new piece of equipment.

IMO this ship is too resilient to be allowed to carry fighters. Hull doesn't matter much, since hull is meaningful in PvE only (hull only determines if you get blown up by the mobs' special attacks); in pvp hull doesn't matter much since when your shields are down you're dead. The shield modifier shouldn't be that high. If you give it a 1.2 modifier I think the ship will be fine, it'll have way more dps than any science ships, pets, and will be somewhat weak to pay for its pets and dps.

Danubes are a completely unrelated issue, I don't think it should be tied to the Vesta. Danubes are also very useful to regular carriers, with a very low turnrate, they allow them to use frontal dps - something which isn't reasonable to do without danubes. If you nerf them you'll severely nerf carriers, and it will allow escorts to tank even more, if they aren't stopped from tanking like mad by tractor beams anymore.

So, nerfing danubes is something you should consider twice, because if you do that you will:
- make carriers useless in pvp. Their turnrate is too low not to be compensated by tractor beams. Most of the time, escorts are immune anyway, and i've never seen a good cruiser really annoyed by danubes.
- make escorts even more powerful, since danubes are one of the main ways to stop them from tanking like mad without any team support. Actually, when I fly my temporal destroyer, danubes are almost the only way to take me down with the snb doff or a tremendous amount of teamwork.

If you nerf danubes them you should also nerf:
- escorts shields. No escort should have a shield modifier superior to 0.85 (including the armittage).
- attack pattern doffs. It makes regular tractor beam useless and gives escort a permanent immunity to them.

Last edited by diogene0; 11-01-2012 at 03:14 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 144
11-01-2012, 03:20 AM
There is only one possitive thing about the Vesta - if it is released in the current form. So many people will buy it and realize how most science abilities suck, because cryptic nerfed them to hell. Maybe the outcry in the general section from pve crowd will finally make Cryptic to fix and buff sci stuff.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,502
# 145
11-01-2012, 03:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwebranflakes View Post
First new content since March? Season 6 launched just over 3 months ago in July.
This is a communication Error:

Definition of the word Content from Dev and Player perspectives means different things:

If a Player says "Content" he means: "STORY", be it Featured Episodes, shorty stuff like Hearts and Minds or single missions like Alpha.
or STORY Progression. (hopefully with memorable characters like Obisek)

There was no such thing in Season 6,
the 10 minute queue maps do not count as "Content" if you ask most players,
those are just "grind maps", there is no Story at all to them.
The best example is on KDF side if REBEL Gorn are attacking the KDF Starbase, there was never any mention anywhere in STO about a Gorn Rebellion, and i want to know more about that Rebellion, heck i want my Gorn Captain to HELP those guys.

"Nukara" was also in Season 6, and sure as hell counts as content, but is there Story?
It really is just a farming Zone with not much Story progression. At best it adds FLAVOR to the game.

I hope New Romulus will supply more Story than Nukara did (i intentonally skipped any text dialogs on Tribble to not spoil me too much), but having played it on Tribble i am sure there is not much gameplay challenge to be found,
feels more like a Tutorial Zone from any other MMO, go there collect flowers and water samples, go here do that, bring me 10 fur of bores... i don't know.
When i first started this game i loved it because this kill 10 rats stuff was NOT in STO, i killed BORG in the Tutorial and i killed Klingon Birds of Prey and Negh'Vars after that... now this stuff appears 3 years later and you guys call it Endgame Content?
mhm... ok... not sure yet what to think about all that.


But if a DEV says "Content": every type of MAP or even Art Asset qualifies as "content",
which is technically the correct term, but not what the Players are talking about or craving for.

We are STAR TREK FANS, we want STAR TREK STORY, and you are not delivering nearly enough of that, no matter what type of Fanboy sunglasses you try on (and i feel like i tried them all).


One thing has improved in STO since Free 2 Play, you keep us busy doing ...stuff.
That is a lot more than Cryptic gave us under Atari, at that time i barely had a reason to log in, now i at least do my dilithium dailies and check on the Fleetbase UI and soon Reputation UI.
But there is still nothing going on with Story...


Some might point me in the Foundry direction now, but the Foundry is Fan Fiction, will never have Voice Overs and at the moment doesn't even have a proper reward System (and i am PI**ED that the Reputation System does not have a Foundry Tab with actual rewards!)

Last edited by zerobang; 11-01-2012 at 03:24 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,395
# 146
11-01-2012, 03:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwebranflakes View Post
At the bottom of the blog, there's a note that states that the stats are subject to change.

Cheers,

Brandon =/\=
I can't roll my eyes hard enough, sorry.

vids and guides and stuff

[9:52] [Zone #11] Neal@trapper1532: im a omega force shadow oprative and a maoc elite camander and here i am taking water samples
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 380
# 147
11-01-2012, 03:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
how about some insane build crafting? this is proboly what i would run out of the gate. not that i plan on legitimizing this thing with a purchase

3DHC/3 beam arrays

sci captain, 3 tech doffs, 2 vm doffs

TT1, CRF1
EPtS1, AtB1, EWP1
EPtA1, AtB1

TSS1, HE2, ST3, VM3
PH1
Exactly what i was thinking of

Except that I would ditch 2 beam arrays for 2 turrets (or 1 trico to drop in the warp plasma)


What is the effect of sensor analysis on tet-glider?
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,764
# 148
11-01-2012, 03:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwebranflakes View Post
At the bottom of the blog, there's a note that states that the stats are subject to change.

Cheers,

Brandon =/\=
seeing as the vesta is a mold breaker, i hope the way it is handled is a mold breaker. all of us wont be able to forget the flagship release, were their stats were vastly OP compared to everything else, and after hundreds of pages of feedback, NOT A SINGLE CHANGE WAS MADE TO THEIR STATS.

everything since then has been power creep snowballing, leading to this ship, now in the same situation. i hope you can understand our DEEP skeptisism. this talk of all this internal testing still going on is very promising though. if at least runabouts are nerfed, i'll be happy.
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,703
# 149
11-01-2012, 04:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
seeing as the vesta is a mold breaker, i hope the way it is handled is a mold breaker. all of us wont be able to forget the flagship release, were their stats were vastly OP compared to everything else, and after hundreds of pages of feedback, NOT A SINGLE CHANGE WAS MADE TO THEIR STATS.

everything since then has been power creep snowballing, leading to this ship, now in the same situation. i hope you can understand our DEEP skeptisism. this talk of all this internal testing still going on is very promising though. if at least runabouts are nerfed, i'll be happy.
Serisously totally OP BS ship gets released for 5000 zen invalidating all previous ships of its class. (see oddy) and we congratulate them on finally fixing runabouts maybe at some time, just not the fleet version as there are no T5 starbases yet?????

Because they are still testing, without the testers having access to the ship, boy do they value actual play-tested feedback.

BTW, where is Gecko in all these balance debates. Brandon is a marketing bunny, but where is the guy who is responsible for these releases and changes? I would love to hear how we are all to stupid to spec into resists, or what is the excuse this time? What about "there are always counters?"
Joined 06.10
PvP 2010-2011
PvP 2012-2013
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,764
# 150
11-01-2012, 04:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by webdeath View Post
What DDIS? You want a build... Hmm.. Kay..

Tactical Variant/Tactical Officer

Cmd Sci: TBR 3, Viral 1, TSS 2, HE 1
LtC Universal: Emergency power to shields 1, Aux to Bat 1, Eject Warp Plasma 1
Lt Engineering: Emergency power to Aux 1, Aux to Bat 1
Lt Tac: Tac Team 1, Rapid Fire 1 or Torp Spread 2
Ensign Universal: Tractor Beam 1

Console Slots:
2 Engineering: Resistance and/or Borg console
4 Sci: Particle Generator x4
4 Tac: Energy type or Kinetic Damage type of choice

DOFFS:
3x Technicians
2x Viral or 2x Torpedo

Sensor Analsis.. check..
All Boff powers on Global? Double check.
The ability to obliterate the enemy? Triple check.. (Or maybe I'm just delusional )

What? I should be focusing on those new Aux DHC's? Pfft.. Regular DHC's will work fine!
this is what i'd use for a tac captain, mine was more sci cap focused. having your own tractor beam, at global cooldown, is pretty cruel and unusual punishment wile also having a runabout hanger lol
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
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