Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,282
# 1 Borg
11-02-2012, 05:50 AM
Well I like the STF's but cryptic made it a super enemy, not that it is realy a problem to handle but can cryptic inplement a code so rookies stay out elite gaming unless they have sufficient expierience in the STF ?
I mean to put that in the season 7 patch, just would make a lot off people proud.

Greets from a season 7 fan
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,483
# 2
11-02-2012, 06:05 AM
Do you have any ideas in how Cryptic can automatically sort those with "experience" from those without? What qualifies as experience? How will new people be expected to gain experience if they are not allowed run content with people who have done it before? Certainly, those who are attentive and try to hash out tactics will succeed or almost succeed - but how many will just quit and never come back?
nynik | Join Date: Dec 2009
<Dev> Oaks@dstahl: *checks for CBS listening devices in the office*

Last edited by nynik; 11-02-2012 at 06:23 AM.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 606
# 3
11-02-2012, 06:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nynik View Post
Do you have any ideas in how Cryptic can automatically sort those with "experience" from those without? What qualifies as experience? How will new people be expected to gain experience if they are not allowed run content with people who have done it before? Certainly, those who are attentive and try to hash out tactics will succeed or be almost succeed - but how many will just quit and never come back?
I'd say set requirements for entering an Elite STF.

Say you want to enter Cure Space Elite, but have never even done the normal one before, I'd say that person would need to do Cure Space Normal at least ten times to unlock the Elite one, sure, it will not bring experience in the Elite version and it's specific tactics, but at least then the person has a basic idea of what the STF is like.

I see no reason why not to do it, it better prepares people for Elite and reduces the amount of times experienced Elite STFers see their round go to waste because someone who has no idea what hes doing screws it all up.

It off course doesn't solve the issue of idiots intentionally screwing Elite runs up to troll his team, but this suggestion isn't aimed at them anyway.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,483
# 4
11-02-2012, 06:35 AM
I certainly understand what your getting at. However, instituting that wouldn't do much to solve the problem it was instituted for. So it is unlikely to be done.

It strikes me a little strange that Cryptic already has a decent system in place to help reduce 'inexperienced' players from entering elite modes - yet they have purposefully made it superfluous.

If I am recalling correctly, then normals open up at level 45. If those final five levels took more time to get through, then normals would be the only option available for people to get away from storyline missions, patrols, exploration, foundry or fleet actions.

It then it becomes more likely that leveling players would have run normal modes five or ten times perhaps. Certainly some people will still ignore STFs until level 50, but if the normal STFs were incentivised by more xp etc then it would further help bring people through the content before reaching max level (once it still left leveling players with the xp requirement to run normals a few times).

But really it needs to be a game wide change, not just for the last five levels. I'd rather explore better options to remedy the quality of players throughout the leveling experience by gently shifting them towards a more harmonious play style (team play) instead of expecting them to adapt their ways once they hit 50 by blocking their progression completely. The fleet actions rewarding the highest dilithium (in season 7) may help, although I don't think leveling players really understand the importance of dilithium.
nynik | Join Date: Dec 2009
<Dev> Oaks@dstahl: *checks for CBS listening devices in the office*

Last edited by nynik; 11-02-2012 at 06:38 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,283
# 5
11-02-2012, 07:46 AM
The vast majority of 'baddies' I have encountered have done countless elite STFs and complain that it is the groups fault when the missions fails/takes too long/etc and they cannot even kill a Neg'Var solo in cure space elite.

The only way to fix the 'baddie' problem is to get into an exclusive fleet/channel/etc that does not allow baddies. But then you have to deal with elitist egos so yeah. I'll take the baddies.
Ensign
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 15
# 6
11-02-2012, 08:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bareel View Post
The vast majority of 'baddies' I have encountered have done countless elite STFs and complain that it is the groups fault when the missions fails/takes too long/etc and they cannot even kill a Neg'Var solo in cure space elite.

The only way to fix the 'baddie' problem is to get into an exclusive fleet/channel/etc that does not allow baddies. But then you have to deal with elitist egos so yeah. I'll take the baddies.
This, this a thousand times over.

I've lost count of the times I've beamed into an stf only to find some loud mouth (usually typing in caps) warning everyone that they better be good and do it their way only to find that they are not just useless, but pointless.

Two minutes at the start of every stf. That's all I need.

Two minutes to:

Say hello to everyone
Ask if we all know how to do this stf
Ask if anyone is a litle unsure and wants a quick breakdown
Give a quick breakdown
Double check that everyone is on the same wavelength
Double check that everyone has enough gens/componentsand give a few to people if needed.
Instruct anyone i have given stuff to, to make sure they pay it forward and next time carry extra and five them to someone else in need.

I'll take a newbie who listens and takes on board what needs to be done over an eltist any day of the week
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 255
# 7
11-02-2012, 09:25 AM
Well I've been playing a few STFs post s7 announcements and it seems all the well geared players are spamming STFs for the dil while they can like I am. A lot of my recent STFs have been amazingly smooth and fast on my tac, and not so much on my eng when 5 of us gets stuck with each other being all cruisers/sci vessels/carriers but we've still won easily aside from slow kills/some lost opts as result. Just an observation to share when everyone in a STF can pull their own weight.

So with that said, I would really like for a system to be in place but honestly it's impossible. There's just no system in existence that can decide whether you are capable or not of doing elite STFs. Gear is one thing, but it's all about the player, do they have the knowledge of how to use their BOs correctly to stay alive, are they using their DOFFs correctly, do they know how to play the STF, and if they do are they willing to adjust their own strat to accommodate another strat. These are the major issues for elite STF success and not so much the gear they are packing. No system can really judge that, only players can and so they do to some extent by creating STF channels or going through their fleet only.

Oh, sure, you could create a system where it checks if you have a good enough to ideal setup all around but how far do you think the game will go when every time someone tries to do a STF the system is telling them, oh you're doffs aren't good enough, can't enter til you upgrade. Or, oh your BOs don't have TT set up, please do this before you can enter. And so on. Players who complain about the problems need to sooner solve it for themselves by joining fleets and channels than try to make all the lower tiered players abide by enforced rules in a F2P game, and all of them can blow up to their hearts content and all the more advanced players can be the ones doing the blowing up rather than being blown up to their hearts content. Once people learn they can't just skip normals for elites because they think their time is wasted in normals if gear is just going to be upgraded in elites, they'll start doing normals(or investing in MKXI/XII purple gear) and eventually everyone doing elites in the public que will be geared well enough and have at least some knowledge of how to run a STF, rather than you or I carrying them through it.

All of that is a pipe dream, but it's the only way to improve things. You can keep suffering or you can do something about it. That's about all there is to it.

I do think something needs to be done about AFK players, though. Like a system where if it sees that you only provided 10% help aka mostly AFK'd and tried to do "just enough" to avoid detection then it'll slap a 24 hour ban from STFs on that person. It'll hurt a tiny tiny tiny tiny tiny amount of the population in the extreme unlikely event that they just have no choice but to walk away from the computer mid battle, but whatever. Take it like a man or woman so that intentional AFKers can have it stuck to them.

Last edited by romuzarii; 11-02-2012 at 09:31 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,483
# 8
11-02-2012, 09:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by romuzarii View Post
...There's just no system in existence that can decide whether you are capable or not of doing elite STFs...
Yes there is (although its not perfect)! Your fellow players are more than capable of deciding your attunement to content, or if you are failing in commitment to the task at hand - but they are simply not allowed to do so in this game.

We should be allowed to vote people off the island/out the airlock as group consensus (not individual predilection) sees fit.
nynik | Join Date: Dec 2009
<Dev> Oaks@dstahl: *checks for CBS listening devices in the office*
Lieutenant
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 85
# 9
11-02-2012, 09:43 AM
I loved WoW until I started raiding.

I have ZERO desire to annoy and frustrate my fellow players by not pulling the right lever at the right time or by not standing in the fire or by not having the appropriate gear/gems/items/equipment/set-up/etc?

I play this game because I am having fun playing it. I leave the end-game proving grounds to those with something to prove.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 31
# 10
11-02-2012, 09:55 AM
How can you decide who is experienced enough to run STFs and who is not? You can't really restrict access to a certain part of the game just because you don't think a person is any good at it.
The Artist formerly known as Paddoxx
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