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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 21
11-17-2012, 12:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by latiasracer View Post
However, i know it's not tailored for max DPS, but i want it that way because i don't really like cannons, they don't feel "Trek" to me, hence why i've chosen phasers. (Except the one the ship comes with, because they have 480dps and that's flipping nice)
I wasn't sure if you were using the Aux Cannons that come with the ship.

Ok, let's address a few things then:

1) If you don't like cannons, don't go with cannons. You can go with 3x Fore Dual Beam Banks or you can load your ship with Beam Arrays.

I don't recommend this.

The reason I don't recommend this is because you are lucky enough to be in a ship that can use the best weapons in the game, and also has a BOFF layout to make the most of them.

One of the other things to keep in mind is that Aux DHCs that come with the Vesta run off of Aux, every other energy weapon runs off of Weapons.

Mixing and matching those is a bad idea - you're always going to have some weapons be weaker than others.


2) You're saying you're not built for max DPS, so are you specifically building for mediocre DPS?

What are you specifically building for?

You're in a ship, with 1 cannon and you have more tac boff slots than you have Sci boff slots.

So you've already prioritized your Boffs for damage and not CC/Debuffs through science.

This is what I meant earlier by your build being all over the place.


Ultimately you need to pick the thing you want your ship to be good at, a hybrid layout can work very well but you need to prioritize.


Quote:
Originally Posted by latiasracer View Post
About my tactical consoles... I didn't think they where "All over the place"

Chronitons don't do much raw damage, but they are so pretty, so that's why i have the XII console for them.
If they are there to be pretty, you don't need a console for them.

If they are not the main source of your damage output, you dont need a console for them.

If you have an Escort with 3x Phaser DHCs 3x Phaser Turrets and 1 Fore Quantum Torpedo I would still be telling you to take 4x Phaser Relays.



Here's a compromise that might give you both effectiveness and "pretty-ness".


Tac Ltc: TT 1 > CRF 1 > Dispersal Pattern Beta 2
Tac Lt: TT 1 > CRF 1
Sci Cmd: HE 1 > TSS 2 > TBR 2 > GW 3
Eng Lt: EPTS 1 > Aux to SIF 1 (or RSP 1, I forgot to add this earlier)
Eng Ens: EPTS 1

Fore: 3x Aux DHCs with max power to Aux (careful with TBR when doing this, you might consider swapping to Tykens Rift or Energy Sipon)

Aft: 2x Phaser Turret, 1x Mine Launcher (Tricobalts are the max damage choice, but Quantums are still effective - if you go Tricobalt, take 2 launchers - Tricobalts make a giant pretty black hole, maybe that will appeal to you.)

One of the benefits here is that you're maximizing your use of Aux power, your heals and resistances from HE & TSS will be stronger, your GW & TBR will be stronger too.

Your rear weapons suffer drop off in damage due to being linked to weapons power, but you're still getting more from 2 weak turrets that coordinate with DHCs than you are with your current set up.

You can still have quantums (or a chroniton mine actually), you just need to get closer to use them.




Quote:
Originally Posted by latiasracer View Post
The Directed energy manifold is a boost to all energy damage, i'm using that because the phaser relays are expensive, and it boosts my Quantum focus phaser by a little.
They boost all your energy by a lower amount than Phaser Relays.

Quantum Focus Phaser is a Phaser weapon, it is improved by Phaser Relays.

So you don't have more than 1 energy type in your build, you only have one and yet you're still using the worst type of Energy Boosting Console.

Start by buying MK XI Green Phaser Relays, they are about 120k ECs on the exchange right now.

Alternatively if you prefer to use dilithium, if you purchase the unreplicatable materials I will personally craft the MK XI Rare Phaser Relays for you if you do not have a character with maxed crafting at no extra cost to you.

(I don't recommend this due to the heavy dilithium costs, but it's an option - @USS_Ultimatum is my handle)

And there is a very highly detailed weapon plan on my ship, prettiness :3



Quote:
Originally Posted by toiva View Post
I'm sure "prettiness" is a great quality of a ship setup. However, when you have trouble with a ship, I believe that surviving is more important.
Agreed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by toiva View Post
To that I can add that with help of two purple Conn officer doffs (of the type enhancing Tac team), or one purple/one blue, you can do away with one copy of Tac team and slot another Torpedo skill.
If not using torps, forget about this (you'll have nothing else to slot instead of Tac team). Also, exchange the advised TS 2 for an Attack pattern Beta.
With help of three blue or better quality (some players swear 2 purples are very sufficient as well) Damage Control engineer doffs, you can get virtually full uptime on each used Emergency power while only using one copy. Then you could change one of your EPtS 1 to EPtAux 1 or EPtEng 1 to get a nice bonus in chosen subsystem.
This is all good advice, I'm not sure the OP can afford some of these DOFFs but the advice is spot on.


Last edited by ussultimatum; 11-17-2012 at 12:28 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,865
# 22
11-17-2012, 01:31 PM
In the case of using the Aux-DHCs, maybe, just maybe, one could consider using a single beam array instead of a turret. Just in order to use the "free" subsystem targetting.

Btw. How do Trico mines behave with their CD? Is it even useful to run more than one?
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix: Bring in the Allegiance class
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia: Design that long overdue Tier 5 C-Store Raptor
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var: Give us Asylums for Romulans

Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 120
# 23
11-17-2012, 01:53 PM
The OP is proof that Pay2Win =/= Actually Winning... that Vesta setup needs alot of work.

I'd use a setup like this:

Energy Setup: Change all 3 of your presets to MAX AUX. Have the weapon one be 50/25/25/100, the shield one be 25/50/25/100 and the engine one be 25/25/50/100, depending on if you want more DPS from your 360 turrets, more shield resistance, or more engine speed.

Weapons:
2x Quant Torps, 1xAux Phaser DHC (The special one for the Vesta)
3x Phaser Turrets

Bay:
Something that deals damage. Romulan fighters, runabouts, whatever.

Consoles:
2x Nanod Armor Consoles (the +Kin/+Energy Resistance ones)
1x +Shield Strength Console / 1x Rule 62 / 1x Borg Adaptive / 1x Shield Systems
2x Quant Consoles / 2x Phaser Consoles

BoFFs:
TAC LTC: Tac Team 1 / Torp Spread 2 (or CSV1... I like more torpspead, but you might like more cannonspread instead) / Torp Spread 3
TAC LT: Tac Team 1 / Cannon Scatter Volley 1
ENG LT: EP2Shields / AUX2SIF1
ENG ENS: EP2Shields
SCI CDR: TSS1/TBR1/HE3/GW3

DoFFs:
3x Projectile Weapons Officers (this will keep you firing a torp nearly every second, making your effective DPS approach the max damage from a torp... should be around 11K before your sensor analysis kicks in)... 3x purple PWOs will make a Quantum torp fire 2.83 times every 8 seconds instead of 1.00 times every 8 seconds - these are the DoFFs that can have the biggest impact on DPS
1x Grav Doff
1x Shield Distribution Officer
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 534
# 24
11-17-2012, 02:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by defalus View Post
Actually you do need engine power, speed = defense = more chance your enemy will miss you, low engine power lowers your defence so you'll be more prone to being hit by critical hits too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by defalus View Post
Some people just don't get what engine power does for your ships defence or how emergency power cycling works.....
Something a wise man once said:

"Speed is not offense, speed is not defense, speed is not armor, speed will not save your ass from a terminal case of lead poisoning. Skill is offense, skill is defense, armor is armor, and a big stick will keep your enemies at bay."

The game's mechanics may run against this, but in general, More Speed =/= More Survivability.

***

OP, as people have been saying quite a lot, grab at least one thing of Hazard Emitters to counteract the Plasma Fire. And if you're worried about getting hit with the Plasma Fire Proc during a cooldown, then get two things of Hazard Emitters and just constantly cycle between them.

However, for BOff Abilities in general, since you seem to be an Engineering Captain I'd recommend going for Engineering and Science Skills that either heal damage or boost your survivability. For your Engy Lieutenant, I'd swap out EPtW1 with EPtS1, giving you a decent Shield Heal. I'd also slot an Engy Lieutenant Commander into that Universal Slot, and give them another EPtS1, Auxiliary to Structural 1, and a Lieutenant Commander Ability of your choice (I'd go for another hull heal, though). Your Ensign Slot should be a Science Officer, epuipped with Hazard Emitters. And your Science Commander Slot should have at least Polarize Hull (and maybe another Hazard Emitters, if you're really worried about Plasma Fire). Feel free to choose whatever other Science Officer Powers you want.

And whatever you do, OP, definitely Respec your Skills so that they boost your BOff abilities as much as possible.
Originally KiraYamato before the Account Linking - True Join Date August 2008

"In the game of war, there are no clear rules you can follow." - Andrew Waltfeld
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 25
11-17-2012, 02:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by toiva View Post
In the case of using the Aux-DHCs, maybe, just maybe, one could consider using a single beam array instead of a turret. Just in order to use the "free" subsystem targetting.
Yes, that's an option as well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by toiva View Post
Btw. How do Trico mines behave with their CD? Is it even useful to run more than one?
It's perfect actually.

1 copy of DPB has a 30s CD.

Each Trico Mine launcher has 1 min CD, but only 30s GCD.

So every 30s 1 Trico Launcher is available as well as DPB.

Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 586
# 26
11-17-2012, 04:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by heresincebeta View Post
The OP is proof that Pay2Win =/= Actually Winning... that Vesta setup needs alot of work.
This actually made me laugh at loud! Although, i don't Pvp, i went there once... NEVER AGAIN.


Anyway, thankyou for the feedback all, i'm going to respect tomorrow and i'll report back on the perfomance.

Here's my new build, along with revised BOFF abilities. (Over a mil EC gone into this D: Phaser consoles & Turrets are expensive)

http://i.imgur.com/OS1j8.jpg

And espically thankyou to everyone, it's just dawned on me how little i actually know about this game O.o


Note : Both the cannons are AUX heavys, and the particle generator gives the Phaser beam cannon and extra 800 DPS
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,020
# 27
11-17-2012, 07:15 PM
I'd re-read what people have been telling you in this thread since there's still issues there that you need to work on.

I don't have time to elaborate now, but in the spirit of helping you out, I just wanted to point out that Mk XI blue Neutronium Alloy consoles can be obtained for free by repeating the last mission in the Undine series.

(and if you find yourself in need of Mk XI blue RCS Accelerators, the KDF get them free in one of their story arcs).

Best of luck with your ship!
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,865
# 28
11-17-2012, 08:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by latiasracer View Post
This actually made me laugh at loud! Although, i don't Pvp, i went there once... NEVER AGAIN.


Anyway, thankyou for the feedback all, i'm going to respect tomorrow and i'll report back on the perfomance.

Here's my new build, along with revised BOFF abilities. (Over a mil EC gone into this D: Phaser consoles & Turrets are expensive)

http://i.imgur.com/OS1j8.jpg

And espically thankyou to everyone, it's just dawned on me how little i actually know about this game O.o


Note : Both the cannons are AUX heavys, and the particle generator gives the Phaser beam cannon and extra 800 DPS
Well, it's already way better than before.

Still, assuming you didn't get any of the doffs I mentioned (they really tend to be a little pricier), it'd be wiser to use two copies of EPtS.

Either get rid of Scramble sensors (don't know why you'd want to keep it, honestly) and move Hazzard Emitters on the sci commander, freeing the ensign for an eng with EPtS 1.

Or, given you're an engineer that has access to miracle worker (and your HE will be rather strong with high Aux power), get rid of Eng team and get EPtS 2 instead. (Even if you don't, I believe Aux to SIF 1 might be better for you. No shared CD with Tac team.)

@USSUltimatum:
Thanks for the info. I guess the time is right for me to start meddling with mines (3 Aux-DHCs with 2 Tric mines and one Beam Array are tempting with no more than mandatory 25 weapons power).
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix: Bring in the Allegiance class
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia: Design that long overdue Tier 5 C-Store Raptor
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var: Give us Asylums for Romulans

Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 891
# 29
11-17-2012, 08:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by defalus View Post
Actually you do need engine power, speed = defense = more chance your enemy will miss you, low engine power lowers your defence so you'll be more prone to being hit by critical hits too.
While keeping in mind that this is accurate, I'd ignore it as advise for PvE. In PvE you want your power in shields, you want to be able to mitigate damage and heal through it. Relying on damage avoidance is a surefire way to get hammered with some unlucky rolls. This is a big reason why so many people cry about one-hit kills while others don't have the problem.

Better advise would be to just almost make sure your moving so you don't take a negative defense modifier.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 949
# 30
11-17-2012, 10:30 PM
Right off the top:

Max in a power level is 125/100. That 40 weapons power doesn't help your build a ton, especially with the turrets and hope that the beam doesn't get used a ton (mostly for target subsystems or catching a hostile on the run). Better served with (baseline) 25/50/25/100 as your "main" setup.

Single wing of Peregrine fighters don't bring much DPS to the table. Get the Advanced Danubes, their tractor beams will enhance your DPS more than the peregrines do.

That scramble sensors on Amy is very... meh. Nigh useless if you fire that into the group you're about to torp spread & CSV (damage breaks the confusion effect). I'd lean to replacing that with TSS III (shield heal), but a second HE or even another offensive power (CPB? Viral Matrix?) would benefit you immensely...

Aux to SIF is maybe a slightly better hull heal for this build than Eng Team, especially since the team will conflict with the Tac Team. If you run a 2 hull heal build, you're gonna want to be able to call upon them "at will" - when you need the heal from that slot having it tied down by the shared TT cooldown is bad...

It could be just me, but slotting both combos (CSV & Torp Spread alongside CRF & HYT) is "overkill". If I may be so bold:

1. You are allowed to re-slot BOffs during non-red alert times. Create a Tac BOff with CSV I & Torp Spread I, and a second BOff with the CRF I and T: HY I. Swap between them during cooldowns as the situation dictates (probe duty on KA? Slot CSV/Spread, then swap to CRF/HY when Donatra comes out). Switch your Uni. Ensign to a Tac with TT I.
2. That frees up your Lt. Cmdr universal. As an Engineer, you're gonna either want to stock up on heals to complement your innate abilities - Thinking a random ensign power of your choice - maybe an ET that you spam as soon as possible (due to it starting 15 seconds after TT ends, and it puts a 15 second clock on TT), EPtS II (Aux to SIF is on Lt. Engie) and Aceton Beam I - or going all-out Science with Polarize hull / second HE for more uptime on that power / Tyken's or Energy Syphon. In the end, pick BOffs and powers that your skillset complements, I'd rather you go very defensive and high-heal than slot a meek energy syphon that only drains 10 power...
Well, with the upgrade announcement leaving NX and Connie fans in the dust again, can we restart / revisit the T5 Connie and NX threads - since they will no longer be "truly" endgame ships... (after we get the T5 versions, it'll be time to see them added to the T5U upgrade charts too...
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