Career Officer
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 120
# 71
12-18-2012, 12:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by voicesdark View Post
I don't understand why KDF players think this "build it and they will come" philosophy is going to be the savior of the KDF faction.
And how does not building anything help exactly?

Quote:
Originally Posted by voicesdark View Post
The KDF tutorial is an annoying as back and forth disaster, the whole city has absolutely no fundamental design structure to it and isn't really enjoyable to be at, and the spacedock interactions/explore the station and get you're first ship interaction is clumsy at best.
Sounds like an idea of things to improve. I personally don't mind but if many feel the same way you do then I guess it deserves being looked at.

Quote:
Originally Posted by voicesdark View Post
Nuke the KDF, pick out the pieces that are decent get the KDF players to make some solid foundry missions that could port to episodes and start the whole thing from scratch not the pre and post launch mess it is.
I don't think that's a good idea. <- I missunderstood.

Quote:
Originally Posted by voicesdark View Post
And no matter what the baseline issue still exists, Cryptic has lost money focusing on the KDF. I believe it was the November Ask Cryptic where Dan stated this fact again.

sometimes they best way to save something is to destroy it and start over.
For the little focus that they've got. We haven't had no new ships for how long? The things we do get come in lockboxes and not account unlock. At least with all the money they're making from this can't they at least focus more on KDF so that this game doens't feel like Starfleet Online?
It's just sad.

*EDIT*

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwadsdwad View Post
It would also bolster the numbers of KDF players as Feds would be curious to what the missions were like and thus boost sales for KDF content in the store.
Very much THIS. It just offers a different experience with FE's too.
There are some very good ideas on this thread to improve the KDF faction, kudos to all of you that care :')

Last edited by garakfan84; 12-18-2012 at 02:35 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 514
# 72
12-18-2012, 01:28 PM
You know, it would be cool if folks used Foundry to come up with a bunch of Foundry starting-level content to flesh out 'who the KDF are,' what life is like, political situation, and so on.

I'd do it but I'm kind of lackluster in the 'Star Trek lore' department.

(I'm also new to Foundry, only have one mission so far)
Community Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,626
# 73
12-18-2012, 02:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
The problem is, it will take more than one token Season to flesh out the KDF. Having decent content through 1-50 would be a good start, and will hopefully help swell the KDF ranks once players have the option of joining the faction right from the beginning. Adjustable UI would be helpful as well, since a lot of people complain about the awesome red UI.

However, what if more is needed? This is why a dedicated team is needed, so that ongoing improvements are made through the patches, S9 and beyond. Otherwise, it's just going to be a season's worth of improvements to the faction every 2-3 seasons, with the rest of the resources going to the Federation.

Right now, the game is defaulting as Federation when it comes to content. Stuff is released to feddies and poorly copy-pasted onto KDF, or there's 'cross-faction' ships and the like. The best way to change that would be a dedicated team of developers that honestly LIKE the KDF concept.
I'm not opposed to a dedicated KDF team, if and when Cryptic has enough basic gameplay for the faction and there's a measurable cash flow coming from KDF players. They simply are not going to do it without financial justification, and they won't get that until they do more to level the playing field and make playing as KDF more attractive to more players.

So unfortunately, we go back to something of a "build it and they will come" scenario. Cryptic needs to take a step of faith, and then the players need to take one. Hopefully we'll meet somewhere in the middle.
Volunteer Community Moderator for the Star Trek Online forums -- My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. If you wish to speak to someone on the community team, file a "forums and website" support ticket here, as we are not able to respond to PMs regarding moderation inquiries.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Community Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,626
# 74
12-18-2012, 02:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhougga View Post
Blue, I understand you as a "Community Moderator" that you try to keep the peace and help calm angry posts from players here on the STO forums but correct me if I am wrong by saying that Dan Stahl is the "Executive Producer" on Star Trek Online and although he doesn't decide himself which direction the game travels and which turns the devs make, he does decide which resources get placed where they need to be to ensure that once decisions are made by his superiors at PWE, that they are carried out. And as far as I've read and can remember, other people on the STO team have made statements to the effect of wanting to make the KDF an equal faction on par with Starfleet/Federation though these other devs may not have the authority and influence on STO with PWE that Dan Stahl does.

And in my opinion if you make a statement on what will be added into a/the game and don't/can't deliver, it is advisable to not keep making the same claim repeatedly multiple times because it is possible that after making the statement on multiple occasions without making good on them, such statements maybe seen/taken as "empty commitments" that have gone unfulfilled and likely may never be. But again, correct me if I am wrong because as a once paying customer to STO (when I had the funds to do so), I like it when the head of a game's development team says something new is coming though I completely understand that STO is "subject to change and not all additions to the game will come to fruition" BUT and again, say that an addition to the game is coming "multiple times" whether the statement is a promise or not by oh I don't know, the "Executive Producer" and said addition doesn't occur will generate negative emotions in the player base who might just express their displeasure on the game's forums and after close to 3 years of "Dev Statements" saying that the KDF will be an equal faction on par with the Starfleet/Federation, well Blue, that is exactly what I'm doing now.
I don't disagree with anything you said. And they absolutely need to keep hearing the feedback that players are not happy with where the KDF are and want changes.

The fact that there are people at Cryptic, including Dan Stahl, who are saying they want a better KDF experience leads me to believe that it's practically inevitable that they will take steps in that direction.

When they do that, how far they go, and how well they execute is anybody's guess. It's also important to remember that either CBS or PWE have the power to veto anything Cryptic might want to do with the KDF. And that if there is resistance to the plan, we will never find out because Cryptic won't be able to say anything about it one way or the other even if they wanted to. We learned that lesson with Atari.

All I ask, as a moderator, is that we keep our posts "clean" of anything that amounts to a personal attack, unproveable accusations, or deliberate provocations. I don't nuke constructive feedback even if it's negative and I let "venting" alone if it doesn't cross the lines set by the forum rules.
Volunteer Community Moderator for the Star Trek Online forums -- My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. If you wish to speak to someone on the community team, file a "forums and website" support ticket here, as we are not able to respond to PMs regarding moderation inquiries.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,273
# 75
12-18-2012, 03:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zahinder View Post
I think this game is great, the devs have done amazing work, and there is a sheer range of THINGS TO DO far surpassing many other MMOs. They actually pay attention to the development of the game, compared to, oh, Champions Online...

All that said? The handling of KDF is jaw-droppingly stupid.


Personally? I'd be happy if one could start with a new account as KDF, at level 1. And don't add much of anything.

Yes, it'd be rough, but I'd rather have people struggle a little bit to get up to speed (doing the city run-around mission, PvP, maybe some early exploration missions and Foundry).

I'd like day-1 access and content. If I can't have the extra content, dear Kahless, give people access to the game without getting hip-deep in Federation.

I mean, seriously, wtf were they thinking? That's almost designed for failure.
We used to start at level 5. . .with roughly the same exclusive content we have now. It was even more dispersed. It was a rather dull, repetitive grind to hit level 40-50, even after the introduction of the Mirror Universe invasions and the XP they generate for you. There was a lot of complaining about it. So, they reduced the amount of XP it took to advance, and then later modified the KDF faction so it started at lvl 24-25. The reasoning was that they would keep it there until they had KDF content to fill the earlier/mid levels with.

Assuming they're actually working on a LOT of KDF content for Season 8, we'll most likely see a reduction in the starting level for KDF.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 89
# 76
12-19-2012, 09:03 AM
How about a petition for more KDF content? so they can actually see how many players actually want more content for KDF?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 622
# 77
12-19-2012, 11:22 AM
wej Heghchugh vay', SuvtaH SuvwI'.
A warrior fights to the death.

Simply wishing us away won't work, Cryptic.
All cloaks should be canon.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,043
# 78
12-19-2012, 01:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesburtchell View Post
How about a petition for more KDF content? so they can actually see how many players actually want more content for KDF?
They ran a survey a few months ago. Playable Romulans beat KDF, albeit not by much.
Say NO to mandatory Arc!
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 89
# 79
12-19-2012, 03:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycoticvulcan View Post
They ran a survey a few months ago. Playable Romulans beat KDF, albeit not by much.
then why not do both?
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 723
# 80
12-19-2012, 04:32 PM
Just as an experiment I created a new KDF and a New Fed character a week or three back just to see how long it would take to get to the level cap. The KDF character look about 22 hours, the fed character took about 30 hours.

That really is not a very great long abount of time to play thought the content.. a brand new player who didn't know the game as well would likely take twice that long but the saem thing..is noted... not very long at all.

Most MMO's you spend the first 10 levels or so learning the game, and from there to the level cap learning details of the games mechanics while soaking up game story/lore. then you hit end game content, and other goodies. WOW is the acception to this at this point but then OMG what an increadable about of content availible there, with several races, each with a unique starting experience, and the two factions haveing unique faction based content availible both as solo or co-operative play with many places to linger along the way along with the option of freezing ones XP to linger at differing levels of PvP play and garner some loot and gear along the way befor progressing further. Still and none the less, STO has a long way to go before it offers that level and depth of game play. I really doubt STO will ever get to that point but I could be wrong.

The main issue is and has been the KDF as a faction not really having its OWN content as a faction to play through. This hurts faction numbers like no ones biz, and makes the faction much less attractive as a game play option for players. It hurts STO as an MMO.

Startrek Online is not like any of the other Perfect World titles. While doubtless even in the games current state it's fairly obvious its making its owners a great deal of money at this point. Egad, the game has got to be raking the cash it in on the lock boxes.. master keys require ZEN to purchase, and no matter how the ZEN is aquired someone HAS to BUY the zen in the first place. The money to put back into further game development is there, and quite frankly STO can continue to make great ooddles and scoddles of money for years to come if there is content for the players. Missions are content, and PvP play "CAN" be content if its done right. As it stands at the moment pvP is not a big draw for competitive players because other then bragging rights and some shinies it doesn't effect the greater game in any way what so ever. The story line isn't advanced in any way in PvP play and for PvP to truely attract a certain wargame element really needs to be there to move and advance the story of the Startrek prime universe.

Arena play PvP is not pure PvP.. Its practice for PvP . STO does not have true blue PvP yet. If you want to see tru PvP in a trek setting go back a couple years and look at Starfleet Command-II's dynaverse which was full on territotoriall PvP. Player actions effected what was going on strongly. Faction players could find them selves with no place to resupply thier ships, or repair them, much less aquire new starships if the faction held no planets or bases. Thats real PvP that counted. SFC-II on the other hand lacked to RP elements, ground missions, and story of STO. STO needs that kind of PvP, but it needs a healthy populated KDF gfaction to do it, and without the KDF mission content to draw players that has little if any chance of happening.

The talk about adding more factions (which by the way I would love to see at some point) at this point strikes me as foolishly and hopelessly premature. Considering the state of the KDF, how can anyone assume the addition of a third faction when the game other second faction isn't complete is going to add to the game? There is no logic, or sense in such an addition at this time. I quite understand the champions of a Romulan factions desires to see the RSE represnted by players, but if it is, what are RSE players going to do? PvP? Where..Arena play simply isn't that big of a draw as any MMO other then strait up shooters has ever shown. Factional PvP needs a framework and a story to exist in or its just another fancy shooter.

I've stated, and pounded apon this for three years now. the Studio absolutly needs to flesh out the KDF. Not only will it strengthen the over all game experience, but it will make the game a much stronger pull for non trek gamers and fans, and fans of scifi based PvP play and open up play for the addition down the road of other factions.. Certainly let players start with Fed play, and stay with that faction forever if thats what they wish.

This is a game and at a certain level we need to paraphrase to motto of Star Trek..you know the one I speak of. "To boldly go where no one has gone before" but we need to make a small change that reflects that this is a virtual experience..

To boldly experience what no one has done before.

Flesh out the KDF, make sure STF, and FE's are also written with a second story from the KDF view point (and yes, that DOES mean that pretty much all of the FE's need a KDF player rewrite. Of all of them only the Reman and Defari arcs make any sense..the 2800 has some real issues with making sense from a KDF players POV...as a KDF player I would have challanged the Gorn KDF ambassadore to a dual and killed that idiot for standing in the way of the empires interests.. and while I'm at it..why is a Gorn acting as the empires embassadore there... do you see any Gorn on the high council?)

Once the KDF is a lot more playable then it currently is, then lets see that Romulan faction get developed, after that we should look at the Gamma quadrant, the delta quadrant, or the Borg.

Khemaraa sends.
Release 8.5 "STO The Next Generation"

Let the happy old bug stomping commence, along with refinement toward enhancing each factions play experience!
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