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Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 74
So I was curious what the community thought. I am leaning more toward Ktinga but I love the firepower of the Fleet Vorcha.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,273
# 2
08-27-2012, 09:54 AM
I've been hearing good things about the Fleet Vorcha, personally. I haven't flown either ship, as I don't like flying cruisers (even battlecruisers), and usually stick with BoPs and destroyers. I'm actively using a Hegh'ta on my Tactical toon, and a Guramba on my Engineer one.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 74
# 3
08-27-2012, 02:39 PM
Man I just cant make up my mind which one to fly..they are both amazing..I cant even fly a fed cruiser anymore..and escorts feel hollow hulls to me....

The only thing that I am scared of is a good player in a jem bug ship. Everything else I can handle with skill and the right setup.

I am curious if anyone else has had the blessing to afford to play both Fleet ships with a TAC.

Its really fun.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,138
# 4
08-27-2012, 05:38 PM
For DPS, Lt. Com and Lt. Tac BOff spots sounds like the winner over one more degree per second turn and 5 intertia with only Lt. and Ens. Tac BOff spots. If you want to go really nuts, you could put a Tac in the Universal Lt. as well on the Fleet Tor'Kaht Vor'cha.

I'm loving the Fleet Tor'Kaht Vor'cha with my Tac Captain in Fleet PvE and STFs. It has a fair mix of both tanking and firepower. It has little trouble lining up targets in it's 45 degree arc of my DHCs in Fleet PvE(No worse than my Patrol Escort or Raptor, IMO, and those have 5 more turn). I haven't taken it out in PvP, but I'd bet a good build of it could do well.

The Fleet K't'inga looks interesting to me, but it's down low on my list of ships to grab. One of my fleet mates really likes his, though. I'd like it just to have an end-game capable D7 (from TOS).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 161
# 5
08-28-2012, 12:41 AM
Personally I like the Fleet Vorcha better. Neither is really nimble enough for DHC in PVP, both are nimble enough for DHC in PVE. You want to run at least 2 copies of CRF, and only the FV has that ability. I suppose you could get enough of those canon doffs to make up for that in the FK, but that is a spendy option. I run mine with single canons/turrets + a DBB or QT depending on PVP or PVE. With two Mk XII blue RCS consoles, I can generally keep my guns on even the fastest escorts in PVP, and I get great damage over time in PVE.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,202
# 6
08-28-2012, 01:42 AM
The fleet vor'cha looks more interesting. Don't forget that they are in no way ships for tacs, otherwist they will get the worst parts of the cruiser (low turnrate) and the worst parts of the escort (not resilient at all) without any significant gain but some dps you won't be able to use.

All of these ships are cruisers, which means that they have to survive in any case, even against an elite tac cube, the gate of infected space elite without any trick, or 3-4 cubes and 5-6 spheres at the same time and for an unlimited amount of time. Any cruiser unable to do this is junk. This means that you need the engineer "miracle worker", especially with these ships. In pvp it also means that you have to spare some heals for your allies too.

Last edited by diogene0; 08-28-2012 at 01:45 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,138
# 7
08-28-2012, 03:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by diogene0 View Post
All of these ships are cruisers, which means that they have to survive in any case, even against an elite tac cube, the gate of infected space elite without any trick, or 3-4 cubes and 5-6 spheres at the same time and for an unlimited amount of time. Any cruiser unable to do this is junk. This means that you need the engineer "miracle worker", especially with these ships. In pvp it also means that you have to spare some heals for your allies too.
I can do pretty much all that with a Tac captain in a Fleet Tor'Kaht. About the only time I have to back down is when the Borg hit me with something to put my powers into cooldown, or dealing with spheres and the gate at the same time and them doing nice combos of their abilities. The only trick I use is getting above the Tac Cube, where it can't fire HY Plasma Torps, but it can still throw a lot of other stuff at you and I can tank most all of it. This is without the recommended DOffs too. Though, this character is Skilled for cruisers much more than the average Tac captain.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,202
# 8
08-28-2012, 04:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom61sto View Post
I can do pretty much all that with a Tac captain in a Fleet Tor'Kaht. About the only time I have to back down is when the Borg hit me with something to put my powers into cooldown, or dealing with spheres and the gate at the same time and them doing nice combos of their abilities. The only trick I use is getting above the Tac Cube, where it can't fire HY Plasma Torps, but it can still throw a lot of other stuff at you and I can tank most all of it. This is without the recommended DOffs too. Though, this character is Skilled for cruisers much more than the average Tac captain.
But at some point you'll need the miracle worker, rotate shield frequency (nice emergency tanking skill to give some more shield to friends without any shared CD with your TSS) and the nadion inversion to fire so many weapons at the same time.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 249
# 9
08-28-2012, 04:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by diogene0 View Post
But at some point you'll need the miracle worker, rotate shield frequency (nice emergency tanking skill to give some more shield to friends without any shared CD with your TSS) and the nadion inversion to fire so many weapons at the same time.
Your definition of cruiser is just... yours. The fleet Tor'Kaht has excellent damage output very close to an escort. The additonal tank allows me to survive hits my Raptor cant take. At least for me, there is no reason to ever touch my Raptor again.
Cubes, gates or Negh'vars ? No issue anymore. So yes, the ship is completely fine for a tac captain.
Sure, to make it really shine it takes some expansive doff's. But then it's worth every penny.

As far as I'm concerned, the fleet Tor'Kaht is one of the best acquisition I ever made in STO.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 273
# 10
08-28-2012, 05:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by diogene0 View Post
The fleet vor'cha looks more interesting. Don't forget that they are in no way ships for tacs, otherwist they will get the worst parts of the cruiser (low turnrate) and the worst parts of the escort (not resilient at all) without any significant gain but some dps you won't be able to use.

All of these ships are cruisers, which means that they have to survive in any case, even against an elite tac cube, the gate of infected space elite without any trick, or 3-4 cubes and 5-6 spheres at the same time and for an unlimited amount of time. Any cruiser unable to do this is junk. This means that you need the engineer "miracle worker", especially with these ships. In pvp it also means that you have to spare some heals for your allies too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by diogene0 View Post
But at some point you'll need the miracle worker, rotate shield frequency (nice emergency tanking skill to give some more shield to friends without any shared CD with your TSS) and the nadion inversion to fire so many weapons at the same time.
Hello, I'm a Tactical Captain in a Cruiser and have no trouble tanking the following:

Any Gate (KASE, ISE), any Cube (KASE, ISE, CSE), any Tactical Cube (ISE, KASE), and Donatra.

Even better, it is generally easy-peasy to hold aggro over all but the most ridiculously hard-hitting escorts out there thanks to Threat Control and Mines that are doing 150k damage every thirty seconds or so (usually, one hit from those seals the deal and I have aggro forever) all in the Regent, to boot.

Now, maybe I'm just doing it wrong, and need to go commit suicide or something. I dunno. But I'm just here to say that the idea that the idea that Tactical Captains only belong in escorts is so ridiculously fallacious that you should be ashamed of the constantly saying only Engineers belong in Cruisers. You Captain choice accounts for almost exactly one-third of your ships capabilities and not an iota more. The bulk of its capability comes from, amazingly, your ship choice. A cruiser is always going to be a tough, healing-and-tanking oriented ship. A Sci ship is always going to be (barring the quirky Nebula) a ship with an emphasis on CC-and-healing with amazing shields, poor-to-ok hull, and middle-of-the-road handling. And, without question, every Captain is always going to do more damage in an Escort in anything else because that's what escorts do.

I'll make it even more clear for you, diogene0.

----------------------------------

Tactical Captain + Escort: Highest damage output possible, some survival issues (3 Purple BFI DOffs almost wholly negate them).

Tactical Captain + Science Vessel: Strong crowd control, decent-to-good potential damage output, greatly improves damage dealing ability of offensive science powers, ok ability to serve as an off-healer.

Tactical Captain + Cruiser: Greatly improves damage output of cruisers (particularly due to the ease of surfing your HP down to charge up GDF before going right back to full health), higher damage output (particularly with threat control) makes getting and holding aggro much easier, can still heal team members effectively with powers like Aux2SIF 3, Extend Shields, and Engineering Team 3 (last is really really tricky as must be careful not to deprive yourself of TT and an inopportune moment).

-----------------------------------

Engineering Captain + Escort: Massively improves the durability of escorts by boosting power levels (particularly shields and Aux without reducing speed/maneuverability to compensate), greatly mitigates weapon drain caused by things like Dual Cannons and Beam Overloads making heavy use of them even more practical, and adds two additional survival skills for yourself in the form of Rotate Shield Frequency and Miracle Worker.

Engineering Captain + Science Vessel: Makes their already impressive shields almost completely impenetrable. Can make a solid healer and crowd controller, though with the extremely low damage output, you'll struggle to be useful in STF's when DPS is called for (which is, frankly, most of the time).

Engineering Captain + Cruiser: You make what are, basically, the toughest ships in the game tougher, bring every little to its damage output, and can lose aggro surprisingly easily to your Escorts even when spec'ed heavily into Threat Control. Making a tough ship tougher isn't that useful when it's already tough enough to do the job it came to do in the first place. The only real saving grace here is that you can take things like the Odyssey and Regent and really go hog-wild with Tactical BOff's to augment your team's DPS (with Attack Patterns Beta and Delta) without completely crippling your durability.

--------------------------

Science Captain + Escort: Every minute and a half you get to boost your team's (and your own) DPS nicely with Sensor Scan (especially nice for CC situations), Scattering Field helps to reduce the incoming energy weapon damage you'll be taking, and Science Fleet is a great Shield Regen boost. Sub-Nucleonic Beam is handy for cracking targets that are running defensive buffs or pre-empting abilities like THY and Torp Spread. Many enemies in STF's, however, don't use defensive abilities, so aside from Cubes and Donatra, Sub-Nuc is of very limited value. Hey, at least the cruisers will probably be able to keep aggro off you!

Science Captain + Science Ship: The master of Debuffing... for all that's worth (little, really, as AI doesn't really act in a reactive manner, so using your wide variety of hindering power to cause them to pop defensive abilties that you can then Sub-Nuc isn't all that useful). You're not significantly improving your already low damage output, but you are able to improve your durability through Science Fleet and Scattering Field, and the likelihood of already having Aux cranked up to 11 just makes Scattering Field even nicer.

Science Captain + Cruiser: Has really good team healing/defense synergy thanks to have really powerful hull heals (Aux2SIF, Haz Em, and ET) augmented by really powerful shield boosting and healing abilities (Sci Fleet, Scattering Field, Extend Shields, Transfer Shield Strength), and you have a somewhat nice group damage buff in the form of Sensor Scan. All-in-all as a healer, this is a more useful combo than Eng/Cruiser as it brings quite a bit more to the group dynamic.

--------------------------------------------------

There, I've said my piece on that.

Regarding the Fleet Vor'cha vs the Fleet K'Tinga, I think as a Tactical captain you'd probably get a little more mileage out of the extra ENG capability and turn rate of the F-K'Tinga over the F-Vor'Cha. JM2c, though. The Vor'cha is a toothy powerhouse to be sure. It's bascially a super heavy escort (not as tough as Escorts, though, with less Defense and lacking the cruiser's Eng BOff abilities to offset that fact with heals and resists). 100% viable in pretty much any content, so don't get the idea that you're screwing yourself over if you go out with it.
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