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Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 9,307
# 21
12-15-2012, 12:43 PM
As long as there are shiny sticker rewards for showing up - there will be people that do nothing.

There have been countless suggestions, but they all have faults. They all ignore that as long as there are shiny sticker rewards for showing up - there will be people that do nothing.

Cryptic's actually implemented a working system for PvP. The problem is they're only using it in one place.

You see, there's this little PvP race. You gather at the start (queue) and run the race (do something) so you can get your reward. If you just stand at the start (do nothing) you get no reward.

Amazing, eh? So simple, no?

Yet completely missing from Arenas, Cap 'n Hold, as well as Ker'rat. Course, it's not just Cryptic. Countless games with PvP offer the shiny sticker rewards without requiring anybody do anything. Many of them have tried various things to get around the AFKers - but they all have their faults.

But yeah, if Cryptic were to look at their snowball race...go geewhizbang...they could fix the AFK issue in the rest of PvP...

...but yeah, that's not going to happen.
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Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 421
# 22
12-15-2012, 02:01 PM
Forcing AFKers to respawn might end the match quicker but it doesn't solve anything. Assuming there is actually a situation in which an entire team refuses to respawn, wouldn't it be better to simply leave that match and queue up again knowing that those AFKers are jacked up in a match that won't end? It certainly won't reward them by getting the match over with more quickly (like forced respawning would do).

Besides, it isn't common for AFKers to load up on one side. With any luck you only get one, maybe two, before the other three decide to quit because of the frustration.

Any potential solution does have the potential to create other problems. A vote kick system needs safe guards to avoid griefing. Basing participation on damage or healing can be exploited by suicide farmers. Removing rewards from PvP, or awarding only the winning team, is going to drive even legitimate players away.

Maybe a combination of these things and others could help. We need to make the payout less appealing for people who don't try without making PvP unappealing for those who try but struggle. We need to award trying for the fun of it without encouraging people to gravitate towards to most broken mechanics at any given time. PvP must be accessible, fun, and rewarding.

Drastically increase the gap between winning payouts and losing payouts per match.
- Maybe something between 240 and 60 Dilithium

Drastically increase the gap between winning and losing payouts per daily mission.
- Maybe something between 960 and 480 Dilithium - This is a reduction until you count the dilithium add to each match

Alter the PvP wrapper missions so that they award you for 3/3 wins across any of the 3 PvP types (Arena, Cap and Hold, Warzone).
- 960 Dilithium for 3/3 wins

Add a queue for Premade/Pugmade PvP with additional rewards for winning
- 480 Dilithium per win, 120 Dilithium per loss
- 100 Feet Marks per win, 25 Fleet Marks per loss
- This might split the player base a bit, but also encourages fleet/team play while relieving some of the pressure on new players and PuGs (potentially the revived focus on competition and reduced likely hood of Premade PuG stomping could increase participation in PvP overall).

Of course none of this does anything to actually stop every AFKer. Whatever the case, this should certainly encourage people to try while disincentivizing farming by making the rewards at least a little less rewarding.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,325
# 23
12-15-2012, 02:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by admiraljelle View Post
ty for your reply bubbly...
i finally make my way to the forums to give some input and this ******* says im moaning. Jeesh thx alot i only hope the developers think im not moining and they appricaiate my input..
Just ignore Solvax, i do.

If the PVP Boot Camp gets one person to support his/her team when they would otherwise be AFK, i'd say it was worthwhile. I'd like to think if the camp goes well, Cryptic might get off their arses and give us the PVP we deserve.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 51
# 24
12-16-2012, 12:19 AM
Response to OP is two-fold:

1.) Like it has been said before, the premise behind the boot camp it to raise awareness about PvP, and to give new PvPers the basics to use in PvP, and to also help novice PvPers learn something new to help enhance their PvP experience. Does going through Boot Camp mean that once it is over, you will be an elite PvPer? No, but it will give you the building blocks to LEARN about the overall PvP experience and the want/desire to get better so that you can, little by little, become better at the art of STO PvP.

2.) AFKers and Farmers do nothing but further my desire for a "Vote to Kick" button. YES, Cryptic, it can be abused....but at this time, the rewards far out-weigh the detriment of having said button. Leave the reward in for the player who goes in and gives his all, and take the rewards away from the farmers.

The worst that can happen is farmers will now have to take an active role in their farming techniques, rather than starting a BOT that will join a match and just sit there. If a team sees that one of their teammates is just sitting and not doing anything to contribute, then they kick said afker/farmer with the understanding that they will not be getting a new teammate to help them out, but will have to rely on a 4v5 setup. I, for one, would gladly take a loss in a match to know that a farmer/afker won't benefit from my loss.

This is my opinion only, but if you take the football away from someone enough times, then eventually, they won't want to play the game (accept for Charlie Brown, but he is a masochist.) The quick/dirty solution is to implement a "Vote to Kick" button, IMO.
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