Lieutenant
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 41
# 1 Engineers too underpowered
12-25-2012, 08:47 PM
I am a veteran player and have been playing STO since it came out but....
Engineers are too underpowered.
I get one shotted by every Tac every time by Pluse by Snipe.

The Eng snipe cant break the Maco and Omega shield set.

Seriously, I'm gettin tired of this. Someone please make the Engies viable.

Can't compete agains the Tacs and Sci. We need serious upgrades to our kits to make us viable.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,813
# 2
12-25-2012, 08:54 PM
TACs should be powerful, but there are calculated ways for an ENG to work around this and survive.

On the other hand, as a very long time SCI player, I have to completely disagree with your assessment in this department.

SCIs have been nerfed and bugged to the point at which even against NPCs, more often than not, it can be quite a struggle to survive. (both on the ground and in space)

I truly am a glutton-for-punishment as I continue to hope that the SCI powers will see something of an improvement in the future.

A somewhat recent addition to the game, The Shard Of Possibilities, IMO, has improved the lot of a SCI player to a small degree as of late.

As this is the first form of 'back up' that has been available for them since the game launched.
...... DaveyNY ...STO Forum Member since February - 2009
..............Star Trek Fan since Thursday Sept. 8th, 1966
There are No Longer any STO Veterans... We're Just People who have Played the Game for the last 4 years.
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Last edited by daveyny; 12-25-2012 at 09:00 PM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 146
# 3
12-25-2012, 08:58 PM
I agree with the OP. I also agree with ^ that really SCI have gotten knocked down a notch below TAC.

I think Engineers are OK, but the PROBLEM lies in the fact that STO is all about DPS. You don't need to tank what you just wipe out. You don't need to debuff what you just wipe out. Engineers have the ability to do a little healing, but tanking is just pointless in this game.

In PVE ENG/Cruisers can't draw aggro from the enemies so tanking is a moot point. In PVP if you put all your effort into tanking you just die slower, but you still die (generally speaking I'm aware there is exception to every rule). At best you are tanky enough to survive an attack while you throw some heals to your escort buddy that does the killing.

So in summary it isn't that the ENG or SCI are bad, it is that the way the game built is very DPS (TAC) friendly.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 509
# 4
12-25-2012, 09:00 PM
If you're talking about PvP, that's a whole different animal. I can't speak to that. But, you posted in "General Community Feedback" so I'm assuming you mean underpowered in general.

In which case, I disagree. I'm an engineer in a Defiant-R. I've done STFs with tacs in a Defiant-R. You take a good torpedo hit, or pull aggro from a cube, and I can pop miracle worker and Cannon Scatter Volley while the tac is waiting to respawn.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,770
# 5
12-26-2012, 12:21 AM
Mmm...I dunno, I used to be in this party as well, but...not so much nowadays.

Here's how I feel about it:

An Engineer of good enough skill, can run off on his own in say...Big Dig (I do it all the time). If the engineer uses their buffs appropriately, drops a cover shield for protection and uses all their fun kit stuff, they can wipe out whole groups of enemies. Maybe not in the instant one-shot of a pulsewaving and buffed Tac, but still useful.

That's also something a Sci cannot do so easily. I mean the Physicist kit can hurt a LOT of course, but it's not gonna be as quick as the Eng or Tac, but they can still do something at least, just not to the extreme the other two can.

In space PvE, an engineer with Threat Control maxed out and properly applying his DPS (especially to multiple targets to pull aggro), can hold it well enough (regardless of the ship he's in), along with keeping his ship alive, to allow his sci and tac allies to demolish the baddies.

In an Elite STF in space, I can pull aggro from a baddie like a Tac cube, hold that aggro, and while my DPS might drop due to moving and healing mostly, the others can focus fire, especially a tac who'll buff up completely and destroy the tac cube easily without them having to run away or get killed.

In an Elite STF on the ground though, an engineer can still be useful, but far less so, due to the fact that a Tac can pretty much do what an Eng can (short of kits of course), and all with pretty much raw DPS killing everything so quickly. All the stuff the engineer can do, a tac can kill before the engineer has finished doing it. Because of that, I've found in some cases, the Equipment Technician Kit to be the best choice, especially against a boss like Becky.

So by themselves, an Engineer can be nasty on the ground, with a team, they can be overshadowed sometimes. But in space they can just simply survive everything if they know how (be that tanking with hull, with shields, or with defense %), and can be a good asset if they hold aggro to allow their allies to destroy the enemy.

Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3
# 6
12-26-2012, 12:40 AM
I agree with basically all of these statements. I made a sci first, then a tac then a engineer. First off let me say I was floored at the power of the tac ships. I just cut through everything. I suppose that is the point of tactical. But the time it takes me to kill in a sci or engineer it's.. tiring.


Now I must say in space sci at least has a more interesting variety of skills. These skills are certainly useful for STF's. As an engineer you basically repair. You survive by outlasting.

Now on ground tacs still win. But engineers can basically make a mini base. healing, shields and turrets. The sci abilities are not bad. But they certainly demand more attention from the player.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,041
# 7
12-26-2012, 01:11 AM
welcome to Star Tac Online!
you either go Tac, or suffer from imbalance
Commander
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 438
# 8
12-26-2012, 03:23 AM
If you want them equally matched, why make three classes? Dont forget this game is meant to be played in a team - at least the endgame content.

And since I have played all three of them, I came to the conclusion, that most people play them in the wrong way. You cant play an engineer or a scientist like a tactician. They are not meant for that. In fact, I find it rather funny playing an engineer on ground, because of the artillery, wiping out groups on enemies even unbuffed. And the Sci? He is the doctor.
In Space the Tactician is my favorite, and right behind my Sci. Letter with healing and debuffing. Whats a TacCube which cant fire because of Zero Energy?
And when flying escort, Sci and Eng are pretty good damage dealers. Of course not as powerful as tacticians, but they last way longer in a fight. Like my Sci can tank a cube on ISE while destroying the probes, than destroy it while waiting for the next group.

And pvp? Thats the only thing i dont like flying Eng. But I know enough others doing really well with dealing dps and healing allies while flying a cruiser. And Sci? Again Healing and Subnuc and Viral Matrix, which is really annoying. If your team focus fire while VM is active, its byby for everyone who doest have ET. Well basically, everytime you focus fire its hard to withstand, even with good healers in the enemy team.

Oh and yes, If playing 1on1, none can destroy the other classes. At least with decent players playing them. There are of course those playing who dont use TT, then its like a present for the enemy.
And for a good Eng, you will need at least 2 Tacticians to destroy him. At least!

So of course you cant compare them with dps, they are just different ad have to be played differently for peak performance.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,593
# 9
12-26-2012, 03:27 AM
Engineers are fine
Tac are fine
sci are fine

Balance is fine

if tacs are taking you down
you need to learn to avoid their line of fire
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,561
# 10
12-26-2012, 04:00 AM
since i try to avoid ground combat alltogether it is one of the unbalanced thigs ingame that affect me the least.

But yes, engi in ground combat is totally lame. there is however one kit that makes it bareable...enemy neutralization i think...

engi definately needs some new kits...with new powers, more directly aimed debuffs or buffs.
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