Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 955
# 41
01-20-2013, 08:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stardestroyer001 View Post
I'm going to play the role of diplomat (inspiration: Captain Picard) here, since the last thing we need is a firefight in these forums.

Yes, Cryptic has been ignoring Escorts for a while. We can only hope that the next Escort to be released is a Mirror version (although Mirror ships are hardly anything to get excited about).

The Aquarius is the best attempt on the Starfleet side to build a ship equivalent to a Klingon Bird-of-Prey. But remember, the Klingons are an aggressive race, they are designing their ships with war in mind. Starfleet is a peacekeeping organization - although they do have muscle, their purpose is not to conquer. Therefore, you can't expect to demand Starfleet to change its entire outlook and build Defiant-of-Preys or Aquarius-of-Preys. That's not their nature.

I'd say the Aquarius should be able to match the BoP in tactical and damage potential ONLY. However, it's unique perk would be the ability to have improved maneuverability and durability on one condition: Other Aquarius escorts must be present and in range to buff the main player's Aquarius, and even in that case, only one Aquarius would get the improvement perk. The other Aquarius would be flying as normal.

It's a little complicated and even a little unfair, but it's a better proposal than adding an actual full-out escort (which breaks canon, game stability, and Gene Roddenberry's vision of the Federation Starfleet), or having the existing "escort stall" we're having now.
I wouldn't really go so far as to say we're having an "escort stall" or anything. Cryptic has been beefing up the Escort and Science ship selection a lot more than it was when the game went F2P, when the only T5 Escort options were Patrol (then Fleet), Advanced/MVAE, and Defiant-R.

STO is already a long way away from Gene Roddenberry's vision for the franchise, though. It is pretty sad, but it's true -- the game is mostly about fighting, and features several wars going on, as well as a lot of aggressive Federation characters.

We've already seen ample evidence of the Federation gearing up its warships, too, so... a Raider-style Escort is not really all that out of character anymore, given what's already established in the game.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,553
# 42
01-20-2013, 10:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thratch1 View Post
You call saying,

throwing me a bone? You always insult people when you try to make nice? And you're weeping for "this generation" (note that you have no idea how old I am) based on, and I'm going to make this perfectly clear by setting it apart all on its own...

You engaging in a personal attack against me with name-calling and profanity, while I do not do the same.

Where I come from, name-calling and profanity is not a good thing. And a simple spirited debate on an internet forum is all it took to draw that out of you.

I feel sorry for you, and the people around you, if you think it's acceptable behavior to talk like that to anyone without sufficient provocation. And, again, a simple debate on an Internet forum is not sufficient provocation, since I never personally attacked you, nor used any profanity regarding your character.

Your point of view was "no more Fed escorts", a position you staunchly refused to let go of. Mine was, hey, maybe there is room! Maybe Cryptic can make something fun. Let's use our imaginations instead of saying, "Nope, no more new ships FOREVER!".

So who's really the stubborn, ignorant, immature one here?
Heh... I thank you sir. Your post was highly amusing, if nothing else. I have engaged in no such thing as... how did you put it? Ah yes, "engaging in personal attacks", used no form of profanity or name calling. If you are referring to my comment involving the rear nether regions, you will notice I never called you one, but mentioned your behavior was akin to one. However if you feel that I was saying your behavior was directly linked to your person, I apologize for not being more... precise with my statements.

I also feel I must inform you that you have no idea who I am, how old I am, or what I do with my life, and I know nothing of what I just listed about you either. I think what I find most amusing is the fact that I commented on my staunch opposition against the addition of more escorts (a very nice and well mannered way of putting it, thank you) and because that was not akin to your ideas, you overreacted and started to just blatantly ignore all the evidence contrary to your ideas, presented by not only myself but a number of other posters here.

And as for the throwing you a bone? I was opening up a place for discussion involving your Federation Raider idea (something I still would like to hear more about), but instead you chose to either ignore or put low priority on that part of my posts, instead focusing on my commentary on your behavior and how it was akin to the rear end nether regions. That sir, is immature and ignorant. If you are as refined as you claim to be, you would have ignored the insults (if you see them as such) to begin with, and instead focused on the constructive portions.

As is, you chose not to, so you instead wasted your time defending yourself when it is completely unnecessary.

Now with that rather long and polite commentary out of the way, what kind of stats did you have in mind for your raider? What kind of tactics would you have users use to maximize this ship's effectiveness, and what role did you envision for your ship?
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Tired of Wasting EC and Time trying to get Superior Romulan Operative BOffs? Here's a cheap and easy way to get them, with an almost 100% chance of success.
Why the Devs can't make PvE content harder.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 955
# 43
01-20-2013, 11:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hereticknight085 View Post
Heh... I thank you sir. Your post was highly amusing, if nothing else. I have engaged in no such thing as... how did you put it? Ah yes, "engaging in personal attacks", used no form of profanity or name calling. If you are referring to my comment involving the rear nether regions, you will notice I never called you one, but mentioned your behavior was akin to one. However if you feel that I was saying your behavior was directly linked to your person, I apologize for not being more... precise with my statements.

I also feel I must inform you that you have no idea who I am, how old I am, or what I do with my life, and I know nothing of what I just listed about you either. I think what I find most amusing is the fact that I commented on my staunch opposition against the addition of more escorts (a very nice and well mannered way of putting it, thank you) and because that was not akin to your ideas, you overreacted and started to just blatantly ignore all the evidence contrary to your ideas, presented by not only myself but a number of other posters here.

And as for the throwing you a bone? I was opening up a place for discussion involving your Federation Raider idea (something I still would like to hear more about), but instead you chose to either ignore or put low priority on that part of my posts, instead focusing on my commentary on your behavior and how it was akin to the rear end nether regions. That sir, is immature and ignorant. If you are as refined as you claim to be, you would have ignored the insults (if you see them as such) to begin with, and instead focused on the constructive portions.

As is, you chose not to, so you instead wasted your time defending yourself when it is completely unnecessary.
It's not really so much about defending myself as pointing out your ridiculous behavior.

Simply because I disagreed with you, you told me I was acting like an "***hole". It clearly doesn't occur to you that there's a lot of middle ground between me not caring about the KDF, and behaving like an "***hole". I was on the other side of a debate from you, so of course you assume there's hostility where there isn't... and so you manage to manufacture your own.

Now you're acting smug and superior, after having insulted me. I still maintain that your behavior is actually pretty terrible, and your manners lacking. As a matter of fact, I admit that your terrible behavior is a lot more interesting for me to discuss right now than starships, because if you actually think this way... you need a little help on your interpersonal skills.

Quote:
Now with that rather long and polite commentary out of the way, what kind of stats did you have in mind for your raider? What kind of tactics would you have users use to maximize this ship's effectiveness, and what role did you envision for your ship?
Not only do we both know you don't actually care about that, but if you had really read my relevant posts on this matter, you'd know that I just made that up as a counter-example to your position, which was "there are no niches for new escorts". I thought about it, created an example, and you're latching onto it like having a raider would be my dream.

I was just saying, there's room to grow with new ships in the game. I'm not trying to theorycraft any new ships. I don't really want to.

Are you going to tell me that Cryptic shouldn't grow the game? That they should never add new ships, just because all roles are filled? Can you convince me that no new ships wouldn't lead to a stagnation of the game, or do you have some ideas for an effective and compelling alternate advancement?
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,553
# 44
01-21-2013, 12:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thratch1 View Post
It's not really so much about defending myself as pointing out your ridiculous behavior.

Simply because I disagreed with you, you told me I was acting like an "***hole". It clearly doesn't occur to you that there's a lot of middle ground between me not caring about the KDF, and behaving like an "***hole". I was on the other side of a debate from you, so of course you assume there's hostility where there isn't... and so you manage to manufacture your own.

Now you're acting smug and superior, after having insulted me. I still maintain that your behavior is actually pretty terrible, and your manners lacking. As a matter of fact, I admit that your terrible behavior is a lot more interesting for me to discuss right now than starships, because if you actually think this way... you need a little help on your interpersonal skills.
Alas, if only you actually knew what you were talking about in this department.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thratch1 View Post
Not only do we both know you don't actually care about that, but if you had really read my relevant posts on this matter, you'd know that I just made that up as a counter-example to your position, which was "there are no niches for new escorts". I thought about it, created an example, and you're latching onto it like having a raider would be my dream.

I was just saying, there's room to grow with new ships in the game. I'm not trying to theorycraft any new ships. I don't really want to.

Are you going to tell me that Cryptic shouldn't grow the game? That they should never add new ships, just because all roles are filled? Can you convince me that no new ships wouldn't lead to a stagnation of the game, or do you have some ideas for an effective and compelling alternate advancement?
The sad part is that I was actually kind of hoping you did have an idea and weren't just blowing your horn. As is, you don't have an actual idea here, so I will have to go back to being condescending, smug, and immature, as you would put it. I really was hoping you'd be able to get past this, but your apparent fascination with my "behavior" (if you can call a post on and online forum behavior) is pretty sad.

Your ideas are stupid blah blah blah, you're stupid blah blah blah.

That over and done with, if you had actually read what I said, you would see that yes, I do have ideas for alternate advancement. It's called finish out the (insert white out here) KDF faction. And if you read the rest of the forums, you will see ideas all over. I don't think this game is heading towards stagnation. On the contrary, I see it heading towards lots of new growth. That don't involve escort 3-packs.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Tired of Wasting EC and Time trying to get Superior Romulan Operative BOffs? Here's a cheap and easy way to get them, with an almost 100% chance of success.
Why the Devs can't make PvE content harder.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 955
# 45
01-21-2013, 12:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hereticknight085 View Post
(if you can call a post on and online forum behavior)
You can, and yours is like a jack***.

Quote:
Your ideas are stupid blah blah blah, you're stupid blah blah blah.
Ladies and gentlemen, that is what a braying donkey types like.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,553
# 46
01-21-2013, 01:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thratch1 View Post
You can, and yours is like a jack***.



Ladies and gentlemen, that is what a braying donkey types like.
I like this guy, especially his attempts to illicit an aggravated response from me. You amuse me. Keep on going, I want to see what else you have that I can laugh at. Dance for me jester! Dance!
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Tired of Wasting EC and Time trying to get Superior Romulan Operative BOffs? Here's a cheap and easy way to get them, with an almost 100% chance of success.
Why the Devs can't make PvE content harder.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 955
# 47
01-21-2013, 01:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hereticknight085 View Post
I like this guy, especially his attempts to illicit an aggravated response from me. You amuse me. Keep on going, I want to see what else you have that I can laugh at. Dance for me jester! Dance!
behavior
be?hav?ior
[bih-heyv-yer]
noun
1.
manner of behaving or acting.


smug

[smuhg]
adjective, smug?ger, smug?gest.
1.
contentedly confident of one's ability, superiority, or correctness; complacent; excessively self-satisfied.

You came in here and told someone they were acting like an "***hole" just because they disagreed with you about a video game.

I don't really think there's anything left to say about that.

Last edited by thratch1; 01-21-2013 at 01:51 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,553
# 48
01-21-2013, 01:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thratch1 View Post
behavior
be?hav?ior
[bih-heyv-yer]
noun
1.
manner of behaving or acting.


smug

[smuhg]
adjective, smug?ger, smug?gest.
1.
contentedly confident of one's ability, superiority, or correctness; complacent; excessively self-satisfied.

You came in here and told someone they were acting like an "***hole" just because they disagreed with you about a video game.

I don't really think there's anything left to say about that.
You were called a posterior opening due to your manner of disagreeing. If you actually read your post, you are being quite the sanctimonious posterior opening. It's quite amusing.

Carry on dancing jester, I am gaining much entertainment from your attempts at counter-arguing.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Tired of Wasting EC and Time trying to get Superior Romulan Operative BOffs? Here's a cheap and easy way to get them, with an almost 100% chance of success.
Why the Devs can't make PvE content harder.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 955
# 49
01-21-2013, 01:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hereticknight085 View Post
You were called a posterior opening due to your manner of disagreeing. If you actually read your post, you are being quite the sanctimonious posterior opening. It's quite amusing.

Carry on dancing jester, I am gaining much entertainment from your attempts at counter-arguing.
I don't think "dancing jester" is winning anyone to your side. I think it's funny you think it's even, like, a thing people say, but whatever.

Frankly I'm getting to be pretty ashamed that I'm still in this circle jerk of a "debate" with you. We should both be pretty embarrassed of ourselves here. To outside observers, neither one of us comes out of this thread looking like anything more than a foaming jackass. If/when a mod gets around to this thread, I can easily see it locked or even deleted at this point.

You really should take an objective look at your behavior here, though. I know it's the Internet, and when you're anonymous you can act however you want... but that doesn't mean you should.

And if you really, genuinely believe your behavior is acceptable and mine wasn't, then... wow. The way your mind spins is frightening, and I'd rather cut myself loose from your unfortunate madness.

Last edited by thratch1; 01-21-2013 at 02:03 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 246
# 50
01-21-2013, 04:15 AM
lol this discussion dissolved like over night into a fight. Easy fix

Just because we want something does not mean we will get it. But that does not mean we do not want it. I want the Buccaneers to win another super bowlm I talk about it all the time, will I get it? Prolly not.

And no one has the right to tell anyone that they can't have what they want when they are also standing in line next to them. It's like saying "I'm standing in this line to get over there to get what I want, but you can't stand in that line over there with your money and purchase hat you want because we (We as in you and I and us) Do not need another escort in this game, what we need is more cruisers! (Though we have way more cruisers then escorts, but what we need is more cruisers! Cruisers FTW!)"

Talk about douche bagging it up.

None of us are game developers for cryptic or lawyers for perfect world, or mouth pieces or any of the sort for this COMPANY we are all gamers that enjoy the game and have an opinion and you know what they say about opinions.... so who are we, as in you and I and us to tell someone who is willing to pay out the ducats to get what they want that they can't have it? Isn't that kinda creepy weird, that we are becoming some all mighty figure and taking it upon ourselves to say NO, Your idea SHALL NOT PASS (lol yup i just made this board epic, kittymomo uber to the fifth degree, get over my awesome already. jeez...)

If the guy wants a few more escorts then whats he harm and letting him speak his piece? We have a billion on Ambass, a billion on Connie, a billion on everything in the world, it's just awe striking. I have never seen sooooo many grown up cry babies in my life.... it's unreal. So what's the problem with someone else wanting something else?

If you don't like escorts of their proliferation in this game then take away their DHC's, it's the only reason why escorts are so popular anyhow. They make people feel powerful. You can't blame a ship for it's commanders decision in weapons and everything else lack of defense towards it. So you basically created this monster with all the posting of builds and such and now you are angry that players are beating that horse to death? Isn't that what they call sticker shock? Aren't we simply reaping what we sowed?

But anyway, let the guy speak his peace, do his thing, and that's for both sides, if one person wants another cruiser let him want it, if the other guy wants an escort let him want it personally I want whatever comes out and has my layout, if not i pass on it anyway. I wouldn't mind a more militaristic cruiser or bigger escort.... hmm i might as well get the chimera and settle this all.... tooo bad that never upgraded... you'd think for 300 smakers it would lol go figure.

Last edited by lasonio; 01-21-2013 at 04:19 AM.
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