Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 231
02-04-2013, 01:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by inktomi19 View Post
Overall I think you're right, but there is room for the lockbox ships to still be better without being as overwhelmingly so as they are now.

I think it's also worth considering that the lockbox ships are one of the things people mention for making them leave the game. If they imbalance the playing field too much, they drive customers away. Look at it this way, if you were considering plopping down $20 for a fleet escort, would it be worthwhile given that it would put you at a disadvantage against anyone with a bug? The money for the fleet modules wouldn't be much, but it still seems kind of wasted in comparison.

The sweet spot for Cryptic would be to leave the lockbox ships with a slight edge, but not so much that they make the other fleet ships obsolete. If players aren't going to pay for the lockbox ships, Cryptic should still be trying to make money off them in other ways.
I don't disagree; on the other hand I don't think fleet ships are "obsolete" outside of the very top tier of the game.

The JHAS for example, for the primary market of this game (PvE) has advantages that are all but irrelevant.

Also, ultimately, with the way that boff layouts are set basically in stone some ships will be winners and some will be losers and you can only ever have one best (just imagine the difference in this JHAS conversation if the Fleet Defiant had an Ensign Eng or Uni instead of tac)


Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
we are seeing a slight toning down of lock box ships, the jem heavy could have easily had a turn rate of 18 or something. the movement stats are quite conservative. and the dread is practically nonviable. the fleet ships are fine, though a bit unimaginative. that was a chance to have more interesting station setups of actual klingon and starfleet ships

I think there is potential as we move forward.

What I do not think we will ever see is Cryptic going back and nerfing the ships already in play.


There is an unwritten understanding to this whole scheme and there is a psychology to it as well.

The buyer is willing to take a large risk with their money for a big (vanity) payout.

They expect it to be excellent or possibly even the best in class.

They also expect that it will not be nerfed.



Once Cryptic starts nerfing lockbox ships, faith in the entire scheme from the buyer side will collapse.



Let's take a look at the current lockbox as an example.

It's possible this was a deliberate attempt to keep these ships a bit more in line as opposed to setting a new bar (it's also possible we're about to see another JHAS limited time Doffpack promo and these ships are intended to increase revenue on an existing product as well as generate their own revenue).

On the other hand, from a PvE player perspective these are apparently the ships they have been waiting for (and as someone who has drilled several craptons worth of PvE I personally don't get the appeal at all FWIW).


I don't know if it was deliberate or if they just missed the mark, or if these were expressly designed with PvE in mind and I'm waiting for the next lockbox to see if there any more hints in any kind of over-arching design intent.



Also by your own statement it's very easy for Cryptic to miss the mark completely and create a "nonviable" ship like the JH Dread Carrier.


Here is the real telling point though:

The JH Dread has been hailed as the second coming of awesome in other subforums. It is selling for more than the JH HEC on the exchange, and many players have pointed to it as having made their Recluse Carrier or Cruiser obsolete.




Just let the lunacy of that sink in for a moment, and you have a very clear idea of where the greatest influx of revenue comes from.

Couple that with the demands of shareholders who expect growth for the money they invest into your product, and you have a better view of the big picture of all of this.


Last edited by ussultimatum; 02-04-2013 at 01:31 PM.
Ensign
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 7
# 232
03-30-2013, 01:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by magniacapra View Post
- Beam arrays need to drain way less energy than current, and have higher proc chances to make up for reduced hit chance. - Right now, cannons both do more damage than beams and proc more often. FAW and subsystem targeting is the only reason to run arrays at current.

- DEM needs a massive boost to bleed through damage, it should also become a beam weapon only effect. No real use for it besides the doff skill

- The amount human doffs reduce subsystem disable is too much.

- Did I mention that beam arrays suck?
All weapons should have a chance to proc based on shots fired over time, so the slower RoF weapons have increased proc chances.

DEM needs looking at, currently its not much of a bonus compared to the investment.

Leadership trait needs diminishing returns, having all humans on your bridge crew is really OP. Also goes against the diversity Starfleet embraces.

Beam arrays do suck. Either their dmg is too low or there drain is too high (kinda the same thing)

How about this.
Beam Overload:
"Greatly increases damage on ALL beam arrays by X% for their next firing cycle."
30 sec CD (maxed), 15 Sec Shared CD with FAW and subtarget powers.
Lasts 10-15 seconds or until beam has finished a firing cycle.
Remove the weapon power drain that occurs on the current ability. (why doesn't rapid fire drop weapon power after it's used?)

I think this would be the single target broadside power beams lack.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 233
03-30-2013, 01:14 AM
Leadership is nerfed to Stone Age on Tribble. So you can cut the NEEERF chorus. Your prayers have been answered. Let all Starfleet ships be polluted by green-blooded pointy eared hobgoblins.
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,925
# 234
03-30-2013, 01:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalnar83 View Post
Leadership is nerfed to Stone Age on Tribble. So you can cut the NEEERF chorus. Your prayers have been answered. Let all Starfleet ships be polluted by green-blooded pointy eared hobgoblins.
Ya I agree with you they went a little far with 0.02% lol

Some where not quite half way would likely be about right. I think.
When the messenger comes to appropriate your profits ... kill the messenger.
Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 354
# 235
03-30-2013, 01:41 AM
DEM is very strong engineering ability if used properly.It doesnt need any more buff and neither nerf because it would make obsolete a whole class of ships.It should stay as it is now.

There is at least one fed engineer in game that creates havoc using DEM .When it is on field we have to attack him with 2-3 ships to kill him.True is that all other fed engineers I met in PVP are far behind of that single char.
On kdf side I met 2-3 good engineers that again do good damage and score on top at the end of a game but that is the number of really good engineers that can kill easily a kdf escort using DEM i have met until now in PVP.
"There already is a Borg faction, its called the Federation. They assimilate everyone else's technology and remove any biological or technical distinctiveness and add it to their own."
I refuse to be content :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,069
# 236
03-30-2013, 01:50 AM
I think all escorts should be the same and the only difference should be the way they look.That way all cry babies will have equal ships because we all know thats how things work everywhere .Even in real life all stuffs are equal..is not like the word "best" was invented for a reason.

Btw it doesnt matter that the escort's goal is to have good dps (jhas will always be outdps'ed by a defiant) and wait heals from a healer.Funny how no one complains about the HEC which is a escort carrier but if you mix escort with cruiser people start bit***ing.

also crpytic should nerf everything till the game is turned into pong or have pong's complexity.Seems everyone cant go pass 1 vs 1 which is unfair even if both ships are the same (someone will bi**ch about better consoles ,or better weapon mods ...or "omg you had a purple mk XII rcs and I had a purple mk XI that gives you better turn rate ...its op ,it needs neerf" ). Learn that pvp in this game is for 5 vs 5 (or more if cryptic ever makes the game engine support all the spam)

also if all ships are equal (which I already said is BS) there would be no reason to have more than 1 escort....dun dun dun Pong online ....not to heavy on the brain.

Btw where are those people who wanted tricobalt nerfed and after it was nerfed were raging on the forums?
How about those who wanted romulan boffs nerfed and again rage after nerf?


Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
Here is the real telling point though:

The JH Dread has been hailed as the second coming of awesome in other subforums. It is selling for more than the JH HEC on the exchange, and many players have pointed to it as having made their Recluse Carrier or Cruiser obsolete.
JE Dreadnought is a lobi store ship which has a fixed and well know price of 800 lobies.There are other lobi store ships like recluse or Mobius ...they also sell for 800 lobies.People sell them on exchange to get ec for their lobies .There is no reason to buy a 800 lobi ship which sells for 10 million ec less than other lobi ship( same 800 lobi remember) .Those ships control eachother's price and they will always be @80 mills till cyrptic spams more way to get ec or nerfs the amount of ec people get through whatever people do.

Last edited by adrianm63; 03-30-2013 at 01:58 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 237
03-30-2013, 02:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalnar83 View Post
Leadership is nerfed to Stone Age on Tribble. So you can cut the NEEERF chorus. Your prayers have been answered. Let all Starfleet ships be polluted by green-blooded pointy eared hobgoblins.
Ok I take my words back. The trait just doesnt work on tribble, so the magnitude is unknown. You all leadership moaners might continue your nerf chorus.
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