Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,849
# 11
01-30-2013, 11:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by causalityeffect View Post
Escorts are warships, they are designed to fight
Cruisers and Science ships are not supposed to be fighting.

Thus, why would you put more armor on a ship that isnt supposed to fight ?
Equally, why would you waste space putting in fancy labs and gardens in a warship ?

The reality is: You dont
The only thing larger ships have going for them is more room to put stuff in, for a warship that is weapons and armor. For a cruiser or science ship, that is labs and gardens.

What that room is used for ultimately defines what the ship is supposed to be.
You want to have that conversation about ALL ships in this game being warships - fine, have fun playing with Cryptic about turning all console slots and officer stations universal.




Bonuses tied to specific hulls and weapon types.
That sounds familiar

If you want to adopt the same kind of ship system that EVE Online does... fine. I promise you it will not be what you like and result in the entire ship system of STO being decimated.
No more Tiers because every ship will have to be given a specific role with a specific set of bonuses.

The flexibility of STO's equipment and Boff power system would make doing that extremely difficult to the point your better just gutting the game.
Obviously like the shield mod specific ships may have a better rating than others of their class. So a defiant or prometheus having say a 1.0 where as a dervish having a 0.9 would make sence. (again the numbers are arbitrary)

As to your refernce to what cruisers had in the show. I point out that sto and canon have at best an estranges relationship. And many things we saw in the shows were only there to further a story (the galaxy love people have beaten this to death). Besides I have yet to see a garden in any ship interior. So their existance is an assumption not a fact.

and the weapon thing is just a thought, I did say it was out there.
As a time traveller, Am I supposed to pack underwear or underwhen?

Not everything you see on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 173
# 12
01-30-2013, 11:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by disposeableh3r0 View Post
Obviously like the shield mod specific ships may have a better rating than others of their class. So a defiant or prometheus having say a 1.0 where as a dervish having a 0.9 would make sence. (again the numbers are arbitrary)
Or the Defiant having a higher modifier than a Galaxy because the Galaxy wastes so much of its volume with Cargo bays, shuttle bays, labs and dolphin tanks. While the Defiant is cut down to ribbons fitting in the biggest weapons and warp core they can and slapping armor on it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by disposeableh3r0 View Post
As to your refernce to what cruisers had in the show. I point out that sto and canon have at best an estranges relationship. And many things we saw in the shows were only there to further a story (the galaxy love people have beaten this to death). Besides I have yet to see a garden in any ship interior. So their existance is an assumption not a fact.

and the weapon thing is just a thought, I did say it was out there.
If you want to take the canon dosent apply route then fine. I'm sure everyone who has, will and continue to whine about X,Y,Z in canon will happily abide by this... so cloaking devices for all Federation ships, right ?

The Galaxy Class is an Exploration Cruiser. Using common sense most would assume it's purpose is to explore much like the E-D did and as a result its bulk is used up the same way the E-D was.

If you want to argue that the STO Galaxies are actually... WarGalaxies - Fair enough but that means EVERY SINGLE SHIP IN THIS GAME IS A WARSHIP.
The only distinction is what roles they are supposed to play in being a warship.

If the role of cruisers is to tank, then as a warship they should get a passive buff which improves threat generation to a point that makes them overcome DPS threat from an Escort.
Tada your cruisers can now fufil their role without any change to weapons required.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,849
# 13
01-31-2013, 12:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by causalityeffect View Post
Or the Defiant having a higher modifier than a Galaxy because the Galaxy wastes so much of its volume with Cargo bays, shuttle bays, labs and dolphin tanks. While the Defiant is cut down to ribbons fitting in the biggest weapons and warp core they can and slapping armor on it.



If you want to take the canon dosent apply route then fine. I'm sure everyone who has, will and continue to whine about X,Y,Z in canon will happily abide by this... so cloaking devices for all Federation ships, right ?

The Galaxy Class is an Exploration Cruiser. Using common sense most would assume it's purpose is to explore much like the E-D did and as a result its bulk is used up the same way the E-D was.

If you want to argue that the STO Galaxies are actually... WarGalaxies - Fair enough but that means EVERY SINGLE SHIP IN THIS GAME IS A WARSHIP.
The only distinction is what roles they are supposed to play in being a warship.

If the role of cruisers is to tank, then as a warship they should get a passive buff which improves threat generation to a point that makes them overcome DPS threat from an Escort.
Tada your cruisers can now fufil their role without any change to weapons required.
You are turning this into a ship debate. I was talking about stats for all ships.

You can also argue that cannon applys, but in general its largely ignored to make the game more fun.

As for galaxys or any cruiser sized ship Yes they have a larger internal volume, yes they have more amenities. But that doesnt equate to less hull armoring. Just because no one ever specificaly said it doesent mean they would have less armor than what the defiant had in the show. Given their mass it would be safe to assume that heavy plating was a perfectly normal thing to have on such a large vessel, thus a reason no one ever specificaly had to say "Oh this ship is bad ass because it has super mega awesome story advancing armor." I also never said all ships are warships. I said ship hulls should come with a bonus reflecting their resiliancy.

This game is 30 years into the future of what we saw in the show, the path to 2409 actualy mentions that Geordi and O'brian designed a modular ship design system allowing major upgrades without a major investment of time or resources, so there is a canon reason why ANY ship could carry heavy hull plating.

All of that aside your arguments have had little to nothing to do with gameplay. the game engine, balance, or the mechanics of game play. About the only thing you have contributed to this conversation is a general description of what we see in a tv show.

By you own logic of size vs function a defiant with 50 crew should translate to 2 or 3 special powers while an intrepid should have 10, and a galaxy 20, given that extra labs and work spaces mean more capabilitys.
As a time traveller, Am I supposed to pack underwear or underwhen?

Not everything you see on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
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