Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 60
# 31
02-06-2013, 11:14 AM
To the OP:

The comparison to the Defiant is based on cannon, which leads to my biggest question with the Defiant; why make the enemy vessel so superior to the Federation/home team vessel? This became more puzzling the other day when I learned that the Devs are big DS9 fans. I can understand giving the Bug a uniqueness and a bit better stats for being a lock-box ship, but this ship goes further. I am not calling it an "I Win" button, but a decision maker (by a margin). I have blown up quite a few Bugs in my Defiant but If I could clone myself and duel "Me 1" in a Fleet Defiant and "Me 2" in a Bug, I have zero question who would win. Yes, I have both ships but I mainly fly the Defiant.

We usually hear the 'Well the Defiant can cloak' argument in these discussions. Yeah, the Defiant can cloak, so long as nobody sneezes. For the most part, it's a wasted console spot. It's cooldown is pretty much equal to the respawn button. The other unique ability which the Fleet Defiant was to have is the 5th tac console. That would be cannon as the Defiant has the highest weapons power/strength of all Fed ships (see Memory Alpha). That seems to have been usurped by the F-MVAE, soon to be F-HEC, the JHAS was given it as well, etc.

What I would like to see is the same a few others have proposed as well. Please give it the universal ensign slot. This would allow it to add enough survivability and flexibility to be somewhat competitive in a dogfight with a JHAS. Adding +1 to the base turn of the Fleet Defiant bringing it to a base turn of 18 would be nice as well. It would leave it a safe -2 base turn from the JHAS. Neither of these changes would bring it close enough to the JHAS to be a big threat to Jem Ha'dar sales. There will always be people willing to pay for the best. This would allow those who don't have one or those of us with them who don't want to fly them something somewhat close to compete with. It would also bring it a bit closer to cannon as Nog, the ensign who flew the Defiant (red shirt's job), was an engineer who performed duties from all 3 departments.


In the end though I always compare the JHAS in STO to having a WWII game where the German tank was superior in all specifications to the U.S. one. It just doesn't seem right.

-Maverick/Rhino
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 246
# 32
02-06-2013, 11:21 AM
As a bug owner, I could agree with all of your suggestions for the Fleet Defiant.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,116
# 33
02-06-2013, 11:33 AM
Even though I fly all cannons and do bother slotting the Ensign Tactical officer, I think I'd rather keep the 3rd Ensign officer. Just so I can get 3x Romulan tactical BOFF. Even when they make the adjustments, extra critical hit and severity will be lovely.

On the other hand, I would love to have an increased turn rate for the Defiant.

But, I'm not holding my breath.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 73
# 34
02-07-2013, 01:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by captainf00k View Post
To the OP:

The comparison to the Defiant is based on cannon, which leads to my biggest question with the Defiant; why make the enemy vessel so superior to the Federation/home team vessel? This became more puzzling the other day when I learned that the Devs are big DS9 fans. I can understand giving the Bug a uniqueness and a bit better stats for being a lock-box ship, but this ship goes further. I am not calling it an "I Win" button, but a decision maker (by a margin). I have blown up quite a few Bugs in my Defiant but If I could clone myself and duel "Me 1" in a Fleet Defiant and "Me 2" in a Bug, I have zero question who would win. Yes, I have both ships but I mainly fly the Defiant.

We usually hear the 'Well the Defiant can cloak' argument in these discussions. Yeah, the Defiant can cloak, so long as nobody sneezes. For the most part, it's a wasted console spot. It's cooldown is pretty much equal to the respawn button. The other unique ability which the Fleet Defiant was to have is the 5th tac console. That would be cannon as the Defiant has the highest weapons power/strength of all Fed ships (see Memory Alpha). That seems to have been usurped by the F-MVAE, soon to be F-HEC, the JHAS was given it as well, etc.

What I would like to see is the same a few others have proposed as well. Please give it the universal ensign slot. This would allow it to add enough survivability and flexibility to be somewhat competitive in a dogfight with a JHAS. Adding +1 to the base turn of the Fleet Defiant bringing it to a base turn of 18 would be nice as well. It would leave it a safe -2 base turn from the JHAS. Neither of these changes would bring it close enough to the JHAS to be a big threat to Jem Ha'dar sales. There will always be people willing to pay for the best. This would allow those who don't have one or those of us with them who don't want to fly them something somewhat close to compete with. It would also bring it a bit closer to cannon as Nog, the ensign who flew the Defiant (red shirt's job), was an engineer who performed duties from all 3 departments.


In the end though I always compare the JHAS in STO to having a WWII game where the German tank was superior in all specifications to the U.S. one. It just doesn't seem right.

-Maverick/Rhino
to be honest, i don't really care about canon or not canon. i made the comparison jhas - fleet patrol due to 2 reasons. one reason is the bo layout, the other one is, i have a fleet patrol.

let me take a look at the fleet defiant in comparison to the jhas with the ds9 series in mind
the defiant traveled always cloaked through sector space, knowing that a jhas is a dangerous opponent. when the defiant attacked, it was often enough a cloak strike. in case of a damaged cloaking device, they tried to have another strategical advantage.
correct me if i am not right. but the defiant rules of engagement are not those, a lot of people want to use in a pvp match (these rules of engagement are partially not really implemented in sto pvp).

increasing the turn rate of the defiant by 1, can help too. but i fear, that a lot of other people want an increased turn rate for other fed ships too. it could be wiser to decrease the jhas turn rate by 1.
but to be honest. in such a case, an other stat of the jhas should be boosted (something usefull without a direct influence to hull / shield. maybe an extra bonus on energy distribution)
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