Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 233
# 1 Starships for Dummies?
02-08-2013, 03:25 PM
I grow increasingly concerned that Cryptic tend to designate ships, especially Federation ships in a specific manner which dumb downs from the original TV version of the vessel. For example, the Intrepid Class is actually a light cruiser and is not actually a Science Vessel, they've only made that connection because Janeway was a Science Officer before she was a Captain. The Intrepid is also effectively a Federation "interceptor", capable of doing missions where speed is essential and this is represented nowhere in the game.

Personally, I think it is a bit silly of Cryptic just to have three main sub-catagories of Starships because Federation ships are designed to be multi-adaptable depending on the situation. The only Starship that is really an "Escort" is the Defiant Class. The Saber, Norway, Steamrunner, Prometheus and Akira are all effectively cruisers.

My point is, what is this need to have this "trinity" of ships, why can we simply just take the ship we want a turn it into what we need it to be. Obviously, there are such limitations based on common sense, for example, a Defiant will never be a tank. But why are ships so over-simplified that a monkey could set them up.

Why not make every starships boff officer slots universal and just have "mass" limitations to what you can put on the ship. For example, in Star Trek, a Defiant Class would not have Type XIII Phasers because they belong on a Starbase and require massive amounts of power. The same can be said for Mark XII Shield Arrays which would not be on any of the smaller vessels except for the battleship.

EvE Online has the right idea incorporating a multitude of different combat roles that a ship can use and its ship customization options are great. Could a system like that actually work for STO, allowing ships to be tailored to the players specifications and not Cryptic's shoddy interpretation of what the ship actually does?
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 168
# 2
02-08-2013, 04:10 PM
regarding the Intrepid Class, technically it was designed EXPLICITLY for long term, deep space exploration missions. Which is exactly what the Voyager ended up doing. Long term, deep space exploration missions also generally result in new scientific discoveries about the universe as a whole. That is why the ship is classified as a "Long Range Science Vessel"
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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 233
# 3
02-08-2013, 05:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by helixsunbringer View Post
regarding the Intrepid Class, technically it was designed EXPLICITLY for long term, deep space exploration missions. Which is exactly what the Voyager ended up doing. Long term, deep space exploration missions also generally result in new scientific discoveries about the universe as a whole. That is why the ship is classified as a "Long Range Science Vessel"
WRONG! In the episode "Elogium", Janeway specifically states. "Who thought we'd be considering a generational ship when we were on a three-week mission." Voyager was not designed for long range missions because it was constantly having fuel and supply problems during the majority of Season 1.
Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 254
# 4
02-08-2013, 08:39 PM
the reason voyager have feul and supplie problems in season 1,is that the mission was planned to take only 3 weeks,so the ship only got the supplie's for 3/4 weeks.when you go on vacation for 3 weeks you take only thng with you fot 3 weeks right?

the intrepid is a long range vessel.it have the skills and stats to be away from a starbase a long time,IF they prepare it for such a journey
Career Officer
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 139
# 5
02-08-2013, 09:12 PM
They were not ... prepared!

Join AIE Today! http://forum.myextralife.com/forum/6...r-trek-online/
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 168
# 6
02-08-2013, 10:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by warbird001 View Post
WRONG! In the episode "Elogium", Janeway specifically states. "Who thought we'd be considering a generational ship when we were on a three-week mission." Voyager was not designed for long range missions because it was constantly having fuel and supply problems during the majority of Season 1.
Okay, then what about the other 6 seasons. It took them 7 years to get from the Delta Quadrant back to the Alpha Quadrant. And that was only possible because they had help from the Borg, Undine, Kes, a Time Traveling Janeway, and several other Aliens along the way.

Janeway's reference to a Generational ship in "Elogium" was more specifically to the fact that if they had not received all of that assistance it would have taken them around 30 to 31 years of continuous non-stop sustained travel at their Maximum Warp to reach the Alpha Quadrant. If they had stopped between the Alpha Quadrant and where they started the trip at all, probably to refuel and get non-replicable supplies such as whatever material the Replicater itself uses as its raw building blocks, then the trip would have likely taken closer to 75 years as I believe was postulated in one of the first 10 episodes of the series. Especially since maintaining maximum warp is not as easy as Star Trek Online makes it appear. Even in the Original series they could only sustain Maximum Warp for a few hours at a time. The Next Generation puts a hard cap limit to the amount of time that they could remain in Maximum Warp without having the engines overheating and going critical. Also, please note that unlike in other sci fi series, faster than light travel does not make you immune to being attacked by hostile forces in Star Trek.
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Last edited by helixsunbringer; 02-08-2013 at 10:21 PM.
Ensign
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 8
# 7
02-09-2013, 05:05 AM
Developers want to divide things into class systems (trinity or other variations), because that's easier to balance. Making the Star Trek ships as flexible as they are in the TV shows would be a nightmare, they're just barely coping now when they only have three classes to balance. Free-form classes like the OP suggests sounds pretty impossible from a design standpoint.

Last edited by thunderlake; 02-09-2013 at 05:09 AM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 233
# 8
02-09-2013, 08:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderlake View Post
Developers want to divide things into class systems (trinity or other variations), because that's easier to balance. Making the Star Trek ships as flexible as they are in the TV shows would be a nightmare, they're just barely coping now when they only have three classes to balance. Free-form classes like the OP suggests sounds pretty impossible from a design standpoint.
So explain to me how EvE does it with its multiple classes of ships, all with specific functions and good customization options? Just a point...

Oh and just a point, the Prometheus was originally designed for Deep Space Long Range Tactical Assignments.

Last edited by warbird001; 02-09-2013 at 08:53 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 97
# 9
02-09-2013, 09:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by warbird001 View Post
So explain to me how EvE does it with its multiple classes of ships, all with specific functions and good customization options? Just a point...

Oh and just a point, the Prometheus was originally designed for Deep Space Long Range Tactical Assignments.
EVE doesn't do it.

Each ship there has specific "bonuses" for each hull..if you don't equip the mods that benefit that hull then you effectively nerfed your ship.

Even among the different types of ships you only REALLY see a handful of ships that are actually useful for different tasks. You won't see a frigate trying to do a L4 mission and only with DUST 514 coming out does a Destroyer even have a ROLE in EVE as a combat ship.


These are just a couple examples. EVE may have more ship types but you will find there are more "useless" ships as well.

Lastly, these are 2 completely different games. The only common factor between STO and EVE is that they both involve space ships and they are both in space. The design decisions for each are 100% different.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 233
# 10
02-09-2013, 10:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyias1 View Post
EVE doesn't do it.

Each ship there has specific "bonuses" for each hull..if you don't equip the mods that benefit that hull then you effectively nerfed your ship.

Even among the different types of ships you only REALLY see a handful of ships that are actually useful for different tasks. You won't see a frigate trying to do a L4 mission and only with DUST 514 coming out does a Destroyer even have a ROLE in EVE as a combat ship.


These are just a couple examples. EVE may have more ship types but you will find there are more "useless" ships as well.

Lastly, these are 2 completely different games. The only common factor between STO and EVE is that they both involve space ships and they are both in space. The design decisions for each are 100% different.
So this game is effectively, Star Trek for dummies who don't understand how Starships are supposed to work.
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