Ensign
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4
# 221
02-14-2013, 08:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cushionride View Post
you know what gents at cryptic, im gonna make this short and sweet. its your game and you can justify why you kick us in the teeth all you want it comes down to this. you want to bone us for every second we play this game. you want to bleed us as bad as possible. you might as well take the foundry out of the game, cause as long as its in there people are going to make farming missions. what did you expect. a 5 year old with kindergarden economics could have figured that out. fine take out the only way we can keep up with the rediculous costs you place on us for building our reputations, and bases, and embasy. i mean seriously im glad i dont work for you, cause i would be helping the players find these exploits just to help them keep their heads above water.

the game used to be fun, now its a job. i feel like im playing eve.
You are so right bro.

Thing is i have a Job and i don't need another. And even if i wanted another Job i certainly would not want a Job as boring as the Grind in STO is these Days.

Oh and one more thing. The one who keeps thinking its a good idea to take something away and everything is fine by telling its coming something else for it....someday, that one should better not work in an Industrie where you need to make Money. Just my opinion.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 191
# 222
02-14-2013, 08:49 PM
Just a few things.

First, I agreed that the AFK style Foundry missions were bad and people were rewarded regardless. Those needed nuked. The farming missions were fine. You at least had to fight and be active.

Second, I hated that you pulled the IOR wrapper from the game with FMs as a reward. Why? Because lets face it here, my fleet (as well as others) is pretty small and we pretty much wanted to keep it like that. Less drama and conflicts..etc..etc Plus we are a group of friends and the fleet was created to keep us together as friends, not as a guild to meet status quo that many larger guilds/fleets are made up to do. Taking that out hurts our type of fleets dramatically. When it was added, it was a sigh of relief for us, now we're back to were we started.

Now you say fleet marks were designed to be obtained by fleet actions only, but my small fleet (as again are others) are made up of people scattered across the US and Europe. It is simply not possible for us all to be online at the same time all the time. Therefore when only a couple of us are online, what can we do as a fleet during that time? Not a damn thing. So how are we to contribute to the fleet projects, gather fleet marks and dump into the projects? With the IORs at least when members were online solo or whatever we COULD contribute to the fleet as members of the fleet. Considering my fleet is roughly 20 players and we are running two fleets (one Fed, one KDF) we are working twice as hard and using our Alt chars to supplement during off peak times. Im proud of my guys that both our bases are at T3. But we all contribute what we can, when we can when we arent all online simultaneously. That is what TEAM WORK is...everybody pulling their own weight and contributing to the whole, not having to always do it together as a whole 100% of the time. Christ, its how Cryptic and every other functional entity functions and you should know this Dan. In many other MMOs I've played (and I've played A LOT of MMOs), one did not have to be grouped 24/7 to contribute to the guild/fleet. Simply playing the game and adding resources you've earned made you a contributing member. STO should be no different in that aspect given the reasons I stated above.


Furthermore, when is the last time you and the Devs have jumped into public queues for fleet actions in the game? Your metrics may say one thing, but unless your seeing it first hand, metrics dont mean crap. Its HORRIBLE. Not only are the rewards too small for the time and effort, but also you have AFK leeching, players half-arsed trying and under leveled players joining in that can't pull weight and die way to fast/often working off the backs of us that are. Also the KDF queue on average takes an hour or more just to pop and NEVER does during off peak hours. Its ridiculous.


My suggestions.

Put the IORs back and extend the cooldown from 30mins to say maybe 2 to 3 hours. That would slow down the FM accumulation to standardized proportions and keep the current dilithium scaling to average mission length.

Increase the mark counts for fleet actions and maybe add bonus marks for the skilled players that perform well in those to reward the non-leechers. Base it off buffs, debuffs, dmg..etc.. so that Sci and Engineering captains benefit and not just overrun by tacticals.

Maybe add small FM rewards to STFs, the Mirror Incursion event and the like as they are grouped only events.

For the love of god, do something with Nukara. That place is WORTHLESS. The only people that go there are ones going for the Tholian gear set and/or people that don't know any better. Its dubbed 'Nuke' for a good reason, because its as barren as a nuclear wasteland.

Maybe even consider adding FM rewards for replaying the old Episodes. Out of my 6 characters, I've only played through it twice because there is no reason to replay them at their current value. One can level simply by patrols, Doff'ing and Foundry. This could be a good thing to add replay value to the originals.

Add a way to convert Romulan and Omega Marks into Fleet Marks. My main has 2130 Rom Marks and well over 3k Omega marks that are just sitting after getting the gear I wanted and Tier 5 rep in both.

GPL? Is anyone really buying holo-projectors anymore with GPL? Buying FMs with it could be a nice way to add some livelyness back to Qwarks bar at the Dabo table.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 308
add fleet marks like omega and romulan marks, fleet missions for time completed take longer and give way less then what the omega and even romulan marks get.


for examble
Fleet mission A.gives 75 for missions and 15 for optional a, 15 more for optional b.


also keep dil way it is its manageable.

Treat this like stfs quick and less grindy for small fleets then every one wins.

hope this gives insite dstal.
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Fleet Leader

Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 685
# 224
02-14-2013, 08:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by themarie View Post
As it stands now the situation is DIRE. NO ONE WANTS TO GRIND THE SAME STFS FOR OMEGA MARKS. WE ARE SICK OF THE SAME MISSIONS OVER AND OVER AGAIN FOR FLEET MARKS.

Cryptic, you want us to play the game YOU NEED TO PROVIDE US WITH A REASON TO DO SO.
Here here,

Dan, I'm sorry, But I really have to agree with the sentiment in this post.

I've ground so many STFs at this point that I feel I just might go out of my skull.
The same missions over and over again, then the new rep system, and we're grinding them all over again and again.

What's more, I personally feel terribly conflicted when I log on nowadays.
Do I assist fleetmates grinding fleetmarks, or do I grind Omega/Romulan marks or whatever damned currency out of the ever growing list of currencies to meet my own personal reputation goals?
I can't tell you how often I have to turn down playing with my fleet, because of conflicted goals now.

Yes, the foundry had/has it's exploits, but honestly, It helped me get SOME of the specific currency I needed quickly, to contribute to fleet goals, so I could get on with some of my own personal goals/rewards.

I feel I'm all over the place with my efforts and overall, it's not a very satisfying experience.
New Rule: Stop saying taking out content improves the game, That's like saying: We're taking out the crap you were forced to play for the past three years.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 89
# 225
02-14-2013, 08:56 PM
Nice way to backtrack and act like fleet marks were meant for a limited time reward until the Anniversary event was over. Maybe it would have be beneficial to everyone to announce that earlier on so players wouldn't feel like you just snatched it away for other reasons. That was obviously just a convenient excuse and a funny lie. FM have been given away with foundry play for months now. It originally started with a fleet week that gave out the Fm for foundry play. That reward has been in place for months since then even if other changed were made related to the requirements.
In recent STO interviews they kept touting how the foundry is something they are focusing heavily on in the game so its funny to see how much player animosity surrounds it now. Not to mention most players don't feel they have time for "real" foundry content anyway.
It would be nice to see a focus on some actual new content...not more grindfests and perpetual rebalancing of existing content...
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 689
# 226
02-14-2013, 08:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mutualcore View Post
Nice way to backtrack and act like fleet marks were meant for a limited time reward until the Anniversary event was over. Maybe it would have be beneficial to everyone to announce that earlier on so players wouldn't feel like you just snatched it away for other reasons. That was obviously just a convenient excuse and a funny lie. FM have been given away with foundry play for months now. It originally started with a fleet week that gave out the Fm for foundry play. That reward has been in place for months since then even if other changed were made related to the requirements.
In recent STO interviews they kept touting how the foundry is something they are focusing heavily on in the game so its funny to see how much player animosity surrounds it now. Not to mention most players don't feel they have time for "real" foundry content anyway.
It would be nice to see a focus on some actual new content...not more grindfests and perpetual rebalancing of existing content...
Most definitely agreed!
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 859
# 227
02-14-2013, 08:58 PM
i can see it now = forcing small fleets to merge (with members less than 50) .

it looks that way from the things in dans post which will drive a lot of players away from sto , i would be one of the first tbh because how i see it the smaller the fleet the more you are punished . with the dilithium refining cap at 8k every 24 hours and not likely to change at all things will only go up in price , i say it will get harder for smaller fleets reading the first post of this thread and prices of stuff in the lower tiers will proberly increase .
prove me incorrect Dan ! , i feel sorry for the people who spend time making these foundry missions that will most proberly not get played much now these changes are coming into force . it is becoming a full time job just getting the fleet marks and dilithium etc instead of being a fun game to play , i know that MMO's contain some grind but the way things are heading thats all STO will be .

Last edited by usscapital; 02-14-2013 at 09:09 PM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 191
# 228
02-14-2013, 09:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vengefuldjinn View Post
What's more, I personally feel terribly conflicted when I log on nowadays.
Do I assist fleetmates grinding fleetmarks, or do I grind Omega/Romulan marks or whatever damned currency out of the ever growing list of currencies to meet my own personal reputation goals?
I can't tell you how often I have to turn down playing with my fleet, because of conflicted goals now.

Yes, the foundry had/has it's exploits, but honestly, It helped me get SOME of the specific currency I needed quickly, to contribute to fleet goals, so I could get on with some of my own personal goals/rewards.

I feel I'm all over the place with my efforts and overall, it's not a very satisfying experience.

This also is a very good point. There is just way too damn many currencies and objectives in the game now that spreads things waaaaaay to far out. Between EC, Dilith, FMs, RMs and OMs you torn between doing things for your fleet and friends, or yourself. Consolidate some of this stuff. Like I said in my post, add FMs to STFs and/or the Romulan dailies so that you can accomplish both.

At least with the IORs we could gather dilith, FMs and ECs in a consolidated sweep instead of having to spread out too thin.

We have lives Dan. We can't play STO 10 hours a day man.

Last edited by ryeknow; 02-14-2013 at 09:04 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,333
# 229
02-14-2013, 09:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc8219 View Post
Scaling system isn't fair to large fleets, might as well kick everyone and make it easier if they did that. It doesn't give fleets any incentive to grow. Its never going to happen so people sotp bringing it up. Just be glad higher starbase tiers are even available to smaller fleet and don't require more members to unlock.

The current fleet holding system is fair, and I agree with the changes to investigate officer reports and removing exploits.

That said I wouldn't mind seeing more Fleet events, including some that are pvp.
If there is a fixed cost and a variable cost to the missions, it is still in the large fleets favor.

y=mx+b

Do the math for this: Cost for 1 SB mission to progress=
20,000 + 500(x) dilithium/FM/Whatever makes you happy

10 man fleet = 25,000 dilithium = 2,500 dil/player
100 man fleet = 70,000 dilithium= 700 dil/player
1000 man fleet= 520,000 dilithium= 520 dil/player

Is that really penalizing a large fleet?
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,296
# 230
02-14-2013, 09:06 PM
Just want to say also..

You also have the deferi warzone missions that give out both omega and fleetmarks... so... how about adding fleet marks to stf runs. Deferi warzones arent stfs, there objective type missions that groups do... not really fleet orientated but.. its a group based mission that fleets can do togeather, sooooo.. as stfs are one of the same principles, stf should also give out fleet marks... So lets see some change if your taking out fleet marks from SOLO based stuff...even though foundry daily technicly could be grouped and fleet orientated.

Or you going to turn around and say other...
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Last edited by xlocutusofborgx; 02-14-2013 at 09:08 PM.
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