Career Officer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 623
# 41
02-14-2013, 07:45 PM
Originally Posted by kirksplat View Post
Thanks for confirming that you're not in the pocket of a select group of elitist and arrogant Foundry authors who engage in massive conspiracies to rob players of their fleet marks.

The subtlety is appreciated.
He niether confirmed nor denied, so you're not out of hot water yet.
Most JJ Trek hate = IDIC fail.
Most who don't like the new Star Trek either didn't like TOS, don't remember TOS, or didn't see TOS
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 97
# 42
02-14-2013, 07:45 PM
I'm going to come out and say it. I agree with this, and I'll even explain my reasoning.

First, some background. Our fleet has 7 people in it. Yup 7. And we like it that way. We knew that going into this that building up the starbase was going to be a long haul.

I always thought it a bit weird that the Foundry gave the marks when most of the missions are geared toward solo play. I'm totally guilty of getting the marks this way, but I was always under the impression that Fleet marks were supposed to reward group play.

I also firmly agree with the statement that smaller fleets hang on dilithium over fleet marks. That's been our experience as well. Part of me almost wishes it was an either/or fleet marks vs. dilithium for projects.

I get that the game is constantly being refined, but its a little frustrating to constantly have a moving target of finding content I enjoy with the rewards I'm looking for.

With those said, my problem with the fleet projects is a similar problem I've been having with the reputation system, and that is the fact that the projects are getting more expensive at the same time that we are required to do more of them.

As an example (this is really just an example). To go from Tier 0 to Tier 1 it costs us 10 widgets. Widgets cost 10 EC. Okay, we round up 100 EC, get the 10 widgets, and boom. Tier 1. To go from Tier 1 to Tier 2 it takes 15 widgets and the widgets now cost 15 EC, so suddenly it costs 225 EC. I get the increasing cost, but why not raise cost of items or number of projects but not both.

Want cheap commodities? Yeah you do. Commodity Cheat Sheet (includes food and data samples)

Want to make the game better? Might I suggest this form
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 28
# 43
02-14-2013, 07:45 PM
Just as max level players are now earning far more Dilithium than they ever have due to adjustments that we've made along the way, we will continue to adjust Fleet Marks in the same way.
Yes we are earning more dilithium, but what's the point unless the refining cap is increased to reflect this
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,286
# 44
02-14-2013, 07:45 PM
This will probably be on page 6 by the time I post this. So I don't know if it will be seen.

But I suggested to Branflakes on Twitter yesterday to add FMs to any mission that is played as a team with a 2hr cooldown for repeating that mission (removing the "Spin the Wheel" loophole).

Calculate how much a fleet member could earn as a member of a fleet action and provide a FM reward at a similar scale to every mission that is played as a team.

All you will need to do is add an FM loot table that simply looks if the mission was completed as a team. If not, no FM. If yes, reward FM.
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Last edited by commadorebob; 02-14-2013 at 07:48 PM.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,336
# 45
02-14-2013, 07:46 PM
I have two things that I would like to know on this topic.

Will we be able to do Temporal Ambassador and get the fleet marks reward after the anniversary event ends?

And are there any plans on expanding the New Romulus Embassy Daily missions, with more missions and perhaps raised rewards (now 5 fleet marks)?

And oh 3rd, I still like to know what someone in previous thread asked olivia, if that really is her on her gorgeous avatar?
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 889
# 46
02-14-2013, 07:46 PM
Concurrently, we also closed a major loophole in Foundry missions in Season 7 which removed Dilithium rewards from what many considered "exploitative" Foundry missions (literally "log in click a button" get a boat of Dilithium). The number of players who were exploiting this type of mission was vast and so there were several weeks where we aggressively adjusted Dilithium rewards in order to keep Dilithium earnings back in line with our goal of getting more Dilithium into players hands without using the exploit.


We did this for a number of reasons. While we want players to enjoy Foundry missions, they should not be the one stop shop for all Rewards in the game.
I predicted this under my old name on the old forum software. When the Foundry was first introduced to the public, I spelled out exactly how people would use it as an exploit tool. I went on to explain how the exploit missions would become the sole overriding reason people play Foundry missions and how they would become dependent on these missions. I further went on to mention how people would feel ENTITLED to those rewards and revolt like a bunch of addicts if attempts were made AFTER THE FACT to correct the exploits. Of course this was back in the day before "marks" and "dilthium." I was more concerned about people exploiting EC and Loot then.

Funny how my predictions were born out by actual reality. A bit of business-management and psychology goes a long way twords predicting how people will behave.

Dan, the #1 reason Mark production dropped off in favor of an endless variety of daily-clickers is this: You have yet to release any NEW MARK GRIND CONTENT since the initial introduction. Plain and simple: No one is playing Incursion, no one is playing Colony, no one plays the Starbase Defense missions.

I sit here on the KDF side for hours waiting for people to join up. Fleetmates are board out of their mind running the same handful of missions over and over again.

With the Foundry, one could sit down and come up with a short simple easy way to earn marks and Dil. It should have never been as easy as the Daily Clicker missions... but the possibility of making a short combat mission that paid well was there. That was the intent behind Battleship Royal Rumble.


Cryptic, you want us to play the game YOU NEED TO PROVIDE US WITH A REASON TO DO SO.

I am calling upon you to release two new grind maps per week. You have the technology to do so. The Foundry allows someone at the office to sit down and bang out an ORIGINAL MAP with an original goal. Tweek it so it requires five people. Problem solved.

Or how about this. You have an engine that generates a RANDOM MISSION with a RANDOM GOAL with a RANDOM OPPONENT in the exploration clusters.

Dust that off, amp up the difficulty, tweek it to require five people, and add a small amount of Marks.

Now you have virtually unlimited grind content, that rewards players for teamwork with a very minimum effort on Cryptic's part.

So how about it. Meet our demand for new grind content, and people won't need a reason to exploit the Foundry.
ISE ISE Ba-bee. "If you got the Borg yo... I'll solve 'em check out this shot while my torpedos dissolve 'em"
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 855
# 47
02-14-2013, 07:47 PM
Originally Posted by dastahl View Post
Both of these suggestions are in line with the changes coming.
See, now this is great news.... But the big question on everyones mind is: WHEN????

Changes should've been made to both ends ofthe spectrum at the same time. Not yank the reward from one place, and then arbitrarily re-add it elsewhere "sometime later on, in a few months".

Are we talking days, weeks, months???
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,420
# 48
02-14-2013, 07:47 PM
Well I guess thanks for the Christmas present. Wish I had know it was such when you gave it. I would've played more foundry during the holidays instead of grinding my two alts and running the winter wonderland.

Well I hate it...with a passion. But I understand the logic.

To be frank I can reach my dilithium cap without the Foundry mission. It helps but isn't mandatory. The Fleet Marks were actually a superior reward. So I look forward to what other sources of fleet marks you add in.

If the goal of the past patch was to get more people playing the foundry you succeeded, at least with me. Before the December patch, I played three five minute battle missions daily, usually a Nagus daily. If I was crunched for time then I would do the clickers. I know, I'm ashamed. But that December patch was brilliant and I started branching out. Doing a forty minute mission seemed like it was worth my time. And I played he whole spotlight section bar one or two and was waiting for you guys to highlight something else. I was hoping for the new tools to help sift through the list to the good stuff, I played the raptors trilogy (barring Raptor's Ascendance which is unplayable since you beam into a rock on the ground portion). I had just wrapped up the Olympus trilogy and was getting ready to work my way through the series, I was even gonna play that mission that delves into the Pakled backstory ninety minute juggernaught that it is (I just had to find ninety minutes). I loved some of those Foundry missions. Many of them in fact.

Now I have to grind fleet alerts. Which are vastly less enjoyable. And will take time away from me playing any foundry missions. And reward LESS fleet marks overall. And slowdown my computer. I'll take Marhawkman's suggestion to halve my resolution, I hope it helps with the extreme lag. Fingers crossed people.

(A note to Foundry authors, a suggestion. An episode of Star Trek is forty minutes. If a mission runs much longer than that, please drop a "to be continued...". Cryptic themselves did it when they broke up the STFs which as I understand it were two hours long and linked together at one point. It makes time management much easier.)

As I said above, I look forward to what you guys do to replace it.

But as a primarily and preferred solo player who likes contributing to his fleet, locking this (fleet marks) in to team just aggravating. There should be a way to gain a steady amount of everything in this game without having to endure a queue. Especially for folks who don't have a great deal of time.

Originally Posted by olivia211 View Post
So in this massive posting you said "We're not giving this back. Too bad."

Also, this whole thing about "leave your feedback here and we will look over it" was more of a stahl tactic to buy time until you all released something like this, trying to explain why this was done.

Fact is I don't want to wait months while you figure things out. If you make a change this drastic to the game, you need to have something to replace it now...not months from now.

But I have to hand it to you. You got me. You got me good. Got me for plenty of cash. Well played. Don't spend it all in one place.
Loved your video. Was trying to say that in the last thread when it closed. The music was an exquisite choice.
Yes I support This

"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 91
# 49
02-14-2013, 07:47 PM
fact I just got a survey about what I thought about PWE. I select the lowest options

That was based soly on STO.

Three years I wait for the KDF faction to be finished.
The game was starting to get better until PWE bought. Since then it gone down hill turn into a boring grind feast.

With time gate rewards. Instead of free flowing game I could play when I want as I wanted. So because that I been play other games more. GW2. World of Tanks and SWTOR.

This just stikes what I notice. Cryptic and PWE seem to be amture gaming company and master grind crap producer.

Maybe other like this. I do not.

When Dilthium was add we told it was a time base Currency. based ON that I expect everything in the game to reward some amount of dilthium. Yet here we are a long time later. And still the way to earn dilthium are limit.

Just another lie by cryptic.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 203
# 50
02-14-2013, 07:48 PM
So you basically chose the lesser of two evils when it came to your 'Fleet System design' rather than go back to the drawing board and actually produce a system that was beneficial across the board and didn't gut players who wanted to keep things small and personal amongst friends maybe? And you are actively aware this is a problem 'by design', yet now you are talking of ways to make smaller Fleet's 'play hard' to earn Dilithium? Dil isn't the problem Big D, it's the 8k per day CAP. Do something about that if you really care about the shortage of DIL that much.

All these lock boxes floating around I feel like you guys are thinking yourselves into one. Nobody is complaining about DIL shortage anymore, it's abundant. You obviously know based on your 'metrics' that Fleet Marks were being achieved at a very low rate previous to the addition of Marks to the Foundry, then you obviously realize this will again be an issue now that it is removed. You make statements claiming we should 'look for' you to add more Marks to 'things' in 'the future' which sounds very similar to other statements we've heard on sensitive issues. We are still 'looking for' these to happen.

So, to sum up what I'm personally getting from this post;
-You know there is a shortage of Fleet Marks now, yet are going to do nothing about it in the foreseeable future. Months? Really?
-You know there is a shortage of DIL especially for smaller Fleets, yet you will not do anything to raise the 8k per day Cap which is the real issue.

This doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever. How does this improve anything?

The o3 - Killed you good
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