Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 243
# 591
02-15-2013, 11:03 AM
Also, I'm sure the amount of players in smaller fleets are greater than larger fleets overall.

Sure there are 300 member fleets, but 150 of them are probably alts. Anyone can say they have a large fleet, but do they, really...
“The truth of the matter is that you always know the right thing to do. The hard part is doing it.” - Norman Schwarzkopf
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 622
# 592
02-15-2013, 11:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gstamo01 View Post
If the majority of fleets in STO are less than 25 "active" players, than shouldn't that be the model Cryptic uses to base fleet mark resources. Looking at the change, I would say it is just the opposite.

I am not ripping on the removal of fleet marks from the foundry so much as I am limiting the ability for those 25 active player fleets from actually progressing at a reasonable rate.\

Most MMOs that I have played that had a leveling guild/fleet system, did not do it via grind, but by a shared EXP system. I am not requesting that here, but those systems allowed for a natural progression of the guild/fleet without requiring members to drop what they are doing and spend their entire game day grinding fleet marks.
Any mission done with fleet members should award a number a fleet marks corresponding increasingly to the difficulty of the missions and the number of fleet members in the party.
All cloaks should be canon.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 335
# 593
02-15-2013, 11:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebumble View Post
Also, I'm sure the amount of players in smaller fleets are greater than larger fleets overall.

Sure there are 300 member fleets, but 150 of them are probably alts. Anyone can say they have a large fleet, but do they, really...
Is your sig getting bigger?
Straight from the mouth of one of the leaders of the CDF - "I tell you what, Haven't spent any money either - I'm a lousy freeloader" - Jonsills 17/12/2014
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,289
# 594
02-15-2013, 11:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lordagamemnonb5 View Post
It's not about large fleet vs small fleet. Before, we had an option as to how we wanted to get FM. I did both Foundry and Fleet missions. I could choose.

I have no choice, I must grind the same boring missions, and so do my fleet mates. Not to mention the Foundry is uselss now; no XP awarding IOR, won't bother to play it. Scalling awards that award less dilithium than before, won't bother with the Foundry.

This one action killed small fleets, seriously put a damper in advancing a toon strictly by Foundry wrappers, killed any need to use the Foundry, and now killed choice.
The thing is you people in small Fleets all want your contributions to count for more towards fleet holding progression then mine does. I don't see that as fair to me or others in my fleet. I work just as hard for my dil and FM and it should be worth the same amount as anyone elses regardless of fleet size. If it doesn't work this way I am penalized in that my individual contributions are worth less towards completing a project then yours would be.

No MMO works that way, some in fact even penalize guilds for not growing through maintenance fees that don't scale for smaller guilds, and also by restricting certain guild holdings until they reach a certain size. MMO means massivley multiplayer, that means you need lots of players, it doesn't mean micro multiplayer where you can stay in 5 man fleet and get everything handed to you.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 335
# 595
02-15-2013, 11:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc8219 View Post
The thing is you people in small Fleets all want your contributions to count for more towards fleet holding progression then mine does. I don't see that as fair to me or others in my fleet. I work just as hard for my dil and FM and it should be worth the same amount as anyone elses regardless of fleet size. If it doesn't work this way I am penalized in that my individual contributions are worth less towards completing a project then yours would be.

No MMO works that way, some in fact even penalize guilds for not growing through maintenance fees that don't scale for smaller guilds, and also by restricting certain guild holdings until they reach a certain size. MMO means massivley multiplayer, that means you need lots of players, it doesn't mean micro multiplayer where you can stay in 5 man fleet and get everything handed to you.
??? Eh?

I thought this thread was about removing the marks that effect everyone, big fleets and little?

What have I missed?
Straight from the mouth of one of the leaders of the CDF - "I tell you what, Haven't spent any money either - I'm a lousy freeloader" - Jonsills 17/12/2014
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 228
# 596
02-15-2013, 11:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc8219 View Post
The thing is you people in small Fleets all want your contributions to count for more towards fleet holding progression then mine does. I don't see that as fair to me or others in my fleet. I work just as hard for my dil and FM and it should be worth the same amount as anyone elses regardless of fleet size. If it doesn't work this way I am penalized in that my individual contributions are worth less towards completing a project then yours would be.
You do realize that those in smaller fleets will have to work either harder then you or longer to realise the same progress, do you?
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 243
# 597
02-15-2013, 11:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by solomace View Post
Is your sig getting bigger?
One line at a time..XD
“The truth of the matter is that you always know the right thing to do. The hard part is doing it.” - Norman Schwarzkopf
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 47
# 598
02-15-2013, 11:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dastahl View Post
Fact Check:

1. Fleets under 25 are going to have a hard time completing projects = by design.

2. We will be adding more Fleet Marks, just not on Foundry missions. We will be making several changes up until the May update in order to bring Fleet Mark earning back in line: including reclassifying the difference between Events and Fleet Actions, Adjusting (increasing/decreasing) Fleet Marks with a focus on giving more Fleet Marks in Fleet Based Events, Possibly merging Fleets, Possibly offering other incentives for Small Fleets.



3. Data shows, most small Fleets are far more starved for Dilithium than they are for Fleet Marks. There is need for both, but more need right now for Dilithium than Fleet Marks - thus today's change. More Fleet Marks are coming - just not in Foundry play.
1- Basically saying yet again, "it's not a bug, it's a feature." Never once has Cryptic though to even consider the fact that playing in a large fleet isn't for everyone.

2- Removing the fleet mark rewards before you had a suitable replacement ready to go is quite simply, stupid. You have removed a steady source of obtaining fleet marks and replaced it with the nothing more than the promise of "yeah, we'll get to it when we decide to." Not cool...not cool at all.

3- The need for more dilithium...you mean that resource that you neutered in the last great patch under the premise of "you can actually get more with these changes!" Which, by the way, is not true. I'm still earning the same amount of the purple rocks doing what I've always done.

Once again, we've been smacked with another snap decision that's left us standing in the mud until someone can come up with another grind-fest to replace what was a fun and relatively easy way to earn fleet marks.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 622
# 599
02-15-2013, 11:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc8219 View Post
The thing is you people in small Fleets all want your contributions to count for more towards fleet holding progression then mine does. I don't see that as fair to me or others in my fleet. I work just as hard for my dil and FM and it should be worth the same amount as anyone elses regardless of fleet size. If it doesn't work this way I am penalized in that my individual contributions are worth less towards completing a project then yours would be.

No MMO works that way, some in fact even penalize guilds for not growing through maintenance fees that don't scale for smaller guilds, and also by restricting certain guild holdings until they reach a certain size. MMO means massivley multiplayer, that means you need lots of players, it doesn't mean micro multiplayer where you can stay in 5 man fleet and get everything handed to you.
Massively Multiplayer denotes the total number of people supported for playing the game and relates in no manner to the number of players in any given guild, clan, or fleet. Once again you butcher and carve definitions to fit your argument. It just doesn't work.
All cloaks should be canon.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,289
# 600
02-15-2013, 11:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebumble View Post
Also, I'm sure the amount of players in smaller fleets are greater than larger fleets overall.

Sure there are 300 member fleets, but 150 of them are probably alts. Anyone can say they have a large fleet, but do they, really...
The fleets I am in have been restriciting alts and are constantly booting inactive people to make room for more new people due to always being at the 500 man limit and wanting let new people share in having a developed starbase. Some people have an alt or 2 but most don't keep them in the Fleet to keep room open, we have to use custom chat channels and voice servers a lot because so many people are in the fleet but often not in the fleet on the character they are currently playing.
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