Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,500
# 41
04-04-2013, 10:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
As renimalt and darkfader1988 are well aware, players cannot 'pre-buff' before being hit with photonic shockwave that disables their entire tray which means that they cannot defend themselves for 4-5 seconds

...Snip...
Fyi, aux2damp is the hard counter for stuns that's open to all ships. PSW has a travel time ie not instant effect, and no the tray isn't entirely grayed out (you can use team abilities). Also, you can cut the duration time 1/2 or more depending on your resists.

EpTS is chainable, so you can prebuff this and/or use a high shield power preset if you're not doing anything anyway (eg the beginning of an Arena match).

Changing velocity (turning and speed adjustment) make it more difficult for a player to line up an attack run than it is on a target going @ a constant speed and direction.

There are audio cues an attack is coming you can use as a warning to pull a crazy ivan (don't forget to change Z axis), buff some (not all) defensive abilities (save something for a SNB), etc.
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 677
# 42
04-04-2013, 10:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
As renimalt and darkfader1988 are well aware, players cannot 'pre-buff' before being hit with photonic shockwave that disables their entire tray which means that they cannot defend themselves for 4-5 seconds

Also most cloaked bop players will buff up 6km away so you can't hear them buff up...ergo you don't know when they will attack and before you know it, they are .9km away from you ship uncloaking and spamming photonic shockwave followed by 2 stacks of BO III with HY III torpedo in the pinch.

All it takes is 1 second for minimax and Mt lolly to kill a player...leaving them the extra 3-4 seconds remaining of shockwave duration to spam fireworks gloatingly.

They are well aware that phonotic shockwave was designed as an interupt against healers in general...not as an abusive exploit that gives a bop burst dps player 5 seconds of free shooting anyone without being fired up as they come out of stealth and enjoy killing defenceless players in that manner.

While it may seem like fun to you, its not fun for a player (who could be 10 times more skilled than the bop kdf player) who gets 1-shot killed in any game especially in STO.

Its why they nerfed snipers in tor because no one liked getting 1-shotted ...in the end everyone was happy with the nerf-including the snipers because they still have one of the highest burst dps ingame within star wars the old republic

As for renimalt, you are wrong in that there are hard counters to Photonic shockwave. There are only 'soft' counters and i stress on the word soft. Omega and Auxiliary to damps require you to anticipate when your bop opponent is about to attack and since you can't hear them buff at a certian distance...means they can attack you before you can buff your defenses regardless. Even if you pop omega and auxiliary to damps they have short duration so that's no solution unless you can see through the bop cloak to know when they are about to attack.
Spending 6-9 points in inertial dampeners in skill tree does absolutely nothing to prevent you getting disabled for 2-4 seconds from the shockwave so you still end up being blown up after 1 second. And everyone knows that in a fight, 1 second is an eternity...so 4-5 seconds is antagonizingly worse

Tac team doesn't work fast enough to distribute shields against Beam overload... I am quoating minimax directly as he told me that Beam overload melts your shields before the game's engine reacts and kicks into action to calculate the distribution of the shields. So when you stack 2 beam overload III you can see that tac team is utterly useless ...

Once again you can't use evasive maneuvers or pop rsp once the bop player decides to attack you since you have been hit with photonic shockwave ...so no counter there

and keeping your shield resistence up requires you to rotate your shield buffs if you can't anticipate these bop players. and Most people won't be able to rotate them since they won't have enough shield buffs to keep shield resistence high enough to withstand a 120k burst dps attack in 1 second.

Tractor beam repulsors have a limited range of about 3-4km distance so that's not really a counter to track/ anticipate a bop cloaked player because they will tend to stay 6km away until its time to come in for the kill.

Seriously Renimalt you know this yet why are you wasting your time trying to tell us exactly what DOESN'T work? Its like you want to keep using a broken/ OP, exploitive bop build to 1 shot players unfairly. Every game iv come across, people hated 1 shots which is why Halo nerfed the shotguns in multiplayer because it was op, tor nerfed snipers and so on...every game you name it, nobody should be able to 1 shoot anouther player in 1 second.

Essentially, there is NO known HARD counter or resistence to being stunned for 3-4 seconds at all. There is no known counter to being 1 shot killed. And don't bother argueing that last statement as if I could use RSP to counter BO III they can simply use ramming speed and abandon ship to do kinetic dmg instead of energy...and if anyone's being unforturnate enough to be on the recieving end of that, will know that tac players can do +100k KINETIC dps so rsp wouldn't shield me from that..

No known HARD counter which makes this completely OP/exploitive.

Just my two cents
Not sure what your issue is, but you CAN prebuff whenever you want, and the statement that 6km would be the maximum range to hear people (Which is not the case) but its 10km rather, and its even dependable on camera position.

For the stun duration issue, you can easily get that down to 2 seconds or even less.
I know players I more get lucky shots on rather then consistent alphas, so i know its counterable.

Its damn hard to pop stuff at 10k then evasive at the guy with 220+ impulse and hope you can keep control of your ship to actually keep it in your arc, I dont think you know how a bop is ment to be played vang, since you didnt even know a few weeks ago how i could possibly have a Sci Commander station in a 'TActical vessel' as you described it.

Stay in Kerrat Solo Tank as a zombie, you've also seen how useless your build was in a 5v5 match not a day ago.

Last edited by darkfader1988; 04-04-2013 at 11:01 AM.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 43
# 43 Nothing new in the West
04-04-2013, 11:20 AM
...and so the people still ***** about the BoP, and how its intented to be played...
Hence the name "Bird of Prey"
It will come, it will Hit hard, and you eigther survive or be dead.

But pls go on, whine a little more, so maybe the Feds finally gat a passiv trait on all ships allowing them to decloak enemy ships in 10km radius constantly...

...and destroy on of the last unique playstyles on KDF...
...no wait, i still have my guramba

Besides, whos the Faction, camping with the 15+ Flashmob on the KDF spawn in Kerrat and flaming everyone able to kill even one of the ships in it... sadly i cant post chatlogs without getting banned in the forum.

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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 184
# 44
04-04-2013, 11:37 AM
pre-buffing and chaining abilities will be limited as you can keep your uptime of certian abilities like epts 2x however they would only give you 20-26% dmg resistence which isn't much compared to 120k burst dps...a player will still do over 100k dps despite resistence you would have...not to mention photonic shockwave knocks some active buffs offline so what's the point in pre-buffs even when you can't anticipate them :L

all it takes for a bop alpha is less than a second to kill a player so 2 second resist to stuns is irrelevant.

Mt lolly you know as well as I do that 5v5 was bugged to hell ... I was surprised in your jem bug, your sustained dps was terrible. I could see you were trying to do sustained dps rather than burst dps (like bops) but it was frighteningly shocking.. I don't mean to be harsh dude but your dps in 5v5 wasn't dealing enough pressure in a sustained manner to kill players ...which is why I had to disable their shields, auxilary and give my eps power transfer to buff your damage and other allies damage to make a difference. In otherwords, i wasn't soley focus on healing others but lending support in the role of taking your targets down...all i was lacking was subnuc but I was doing fine without it anways

aux2damp and omega pattern is a counter but it requires that you know when to pop them before some bop dude stuns your ship into tommorrow....

and you can't chain aux2damp or omega pattern since the uptime is VERY poor and has a very long cooldown so it means that you would have to have to be a precog to know when to pop those buffs or risk popping them prematurely then you can say bye bye to your only soft counters as they are on cd

and the average player's reaction time is 1.2 seconds ...a bop alpha will kill a player inside 1 second ...

Last edited by spacefortress; 04-04-2013 at 11:41 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,397
# 45
04-04-2013, 11:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
pre-buffing and chaining abilities will be limited as you can keep your uptime of certian abilities like epts 2x however they would only give you 20-26% dmg resistence which isn't much compared to 120k burst dps...a player will still do over 100k dps despite resistence you would have...not to mention photonic shockwave knocks some active buffs offline so what's the point in pre-buffs even when you can't anticipate them :L

all it takes for a bop alpha is less than a second to kill a player so 2 second resist to stuns is irrelevant.

Mt lolly you know as well as I do that 5v5 was bugged to hell ... I was surprised in your jem bug, your sustained dps was terrible. I could see you were trying to do sustained dps rather than burst dps (like bops) but it was frighteningly shocking.. I don't mean to be harsh dude but your dps in 5v5 wasn't dealing enough pressure in a sustained manner to kill players ...which is why I had to disable their shields, auxilary and give my eps power transfer to buff your damage and other allies damage to make a difference. In otherwords, i wasn't soley focus on healing others but lending support in the role of taking your targets down...all i was lacking was subnuc but I was doing fine without it anways

aux2damp and omega pattern is a counter but it requires that you know when to pop them before some bop dude stuns your ship into tommorrow....

and you can't chain aux2damp or omega pattern since the uptime is VERY poor and has a very long cooldown so it means that you would have to have to be a precog to know when to pop those buffs or risk popping them prematurely then you can say bye bye to your only soft counters as they are on cd

and the average player's reaction time is 1.2 seconds ...a bop alpha will kill a player inside 1 second ...
Were you in a different game or what?? As far i remember, your damage and healing was the worst in the team. There was no meaningfull contribution to the team in damage, heals and suppression whatsoever from you.

Only reason you are complaining is because your delusion about an eng in a nova being usefull as a tank in 5 v 5 scenarios was shattered / destroyed in that game. As far as i can remember, MT's damage was better than anyone in that map.

PROOF

Last edited by naz4; 04-04-2013 at 11:52 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 677
# 46
04-04-2013, 11:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
pre-buffing and chaining abilities will be limited as you can keep your uptime of certian abilities like epts 2x however they would only give you 20-26% dmg resistence which isn't much compared to 120k burst dps...a player will still do over 100k dps despite resistence you would have...not to mention photonic shockwave knocks some active buffs offline so what's the point in pre-buffs even when you can't anticipate them :L

all it takes for a bop alpha is less than a second to kill a player so 2 second resist to stuns is irrelevant.

Mt lolly you know as well as I do that 5v5 was bugged to hell ... I was surprised in your jem bug, your sustained dps was terrible. I could see you were trying to do sustained dps rather than burst dps (like bops) but it was frighteningly shocking.. I don't mean to be harsh dude but your dps in 5v5 wasn't dealing enough pressure in a sustained manner to kill players ...which is why I had to disable their shields, auxilary and give my eps power transfer to buff your damage and other allies damage to make a difference. In otherwords, i wasn't soley focus on healing others but lending support in the role of taking your targets down...all i was lacking was subnuc but I was doing fine without it anways

aux2damp and omega pattern is a counter but it requires that you know when to pop them before some bop dude stuns your ship into tommorrow....

and you can't chain aux2damp or omega pattern since the uptime is VERY poor and has a very long cooldown so it means that you would have to have to be a precog to know when to pop those buffs or risk popping them prematurely then you can say bye bye to your only soft counters as they are on cd

and the average player's reaction time is 1.2 seconds ...a bop alpha will kill a player inside 1 second ...
Yup, lucky for us we had a very good Sci player on the opposing team that kept nuking of my alpha/gdf etcetera.

Its still fact that the only kills we made was done by us and not by your engi sci vessel, resulting in us winning.
In fact, being an engi you still died about the same time as any other player in our team, yet your total healing numbers thrown to teammates was significantly worse then anyone else, and not being able to throw a necessary subnuc towards other players really doesnt help matters. That RSF didnt seem to avoid you being killed either.

If you really think that EPS transfer boosts a tac's damage by a considerable amount I dont think you know what you are talking about, you need to do some re-testing on different aspects of the game.

You are obviously upset about people being able to instavape you, and you basically cry nerf on anything that puts you in an uncomfortable position, or in a disadvantage.

Yet you are probably one of the guys that don't care about 70% Shield resists and don't hestitate to fly a zombiebuild, why would that be any different?

Last edited by darkfader1988; 04-04-2013 at 11:50 AM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 184
# 47
04-04-2013, 11:49 AM
Were you in a different game or what?? As far i remember, your damage and healing was the worst in the team. There was no contribution to the team in damage, heals and suppression whatsoever.


Do you even know the arena ceiling bug dude? for much of the duration of that match I was visibly stuck, my weapons wouldn't fire and most of the time I couldn't heal my allies since they were moving in and out of range with the latter being the more persistent

I had to spam the /unstuck and /killme just to move .20km hundreds of times then i was back to being stuck.

My build isn't complete but the average arena i do with pvp players is around 1.2million dps, 1.2 million heals in a game ... I sometimes top at around 1.5m respectively for a build that is only half completed.

The 5v5 was a terrible match .... your point is moot


Yup, lucky for us we had a very good Sci player on the opposing team that kept nuking of my alpha/gdf etcetera.


Your very lucky I gave you my science team half the time whenever you were subnuked :L
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,397
# 48
04-04-2013, 11:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
Were you in a different game or what?? As far i remember, your damage and healing was the worst in the team. There was no contribution to the team in damage, heals and suppression whatsoever.


Do you even know the arena ceiling bug dude? for much of the duration of that match I was visibly stuck, my weapons wouldn't fire and most of the time I couldn't heal my allies since they were moving in and out of range with the latter being the more persistent

I had to spam the /unstuck and /killme just to move .20km hundreds of times then i was back to being stuck.

My build isn't complete but the average arena i do with pvp players is around 1.2million dps, 1.2 million heals in a game ... I sometimes top at around 1.5m respectively for a build that is only half completed.

The 5v5 was a terrible match .... your point is moot
We were all stuck at 1 point or another

PROOF of how bad you did in the team Vang.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 677
# 49
04-04-2013, 11:51 AM
Not to mention about everyone used fleet shields that match, and since i never died once I didnt have the option to change weapontypes either.

This match is basically an exact replica on how you like to play lol.


These types of matches show the exact reason why some, not all, players in the community are complaining about people being indestructable with all the heals and resists that are floating around. where some that actually participate in this ludicrous shield resist maximinzing business are still complaining when they are instavaped at some point. What do you want in pvp? Nobody ever dies? People keep finding ways to kill others (Fortunately) but if this keeps up nobody will ever get a kill on anyone no more.

Last edited by darkfader1988; 04-04-2013 at 11:58 AM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 184
# 50
04-04-2013, 11:53 AM
We were all stuck at 1 point or another


only 3 players including myself were visibly stuck only once...

I was almost permanently stuck because the bug hit me hardest since i use subspace jump...

The bug exist because of subspace jump when you hit the 'roof' of the arena
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