Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 366
# 51
04-01-2013, 05:31 PM
Originally Posted by stoleviathan99 View Post
I'm saying I think she was probably pretty quick to make that assumption about posts that were actually on topic. And if you're going to throw those posts out, throw them out of the percentage ranking. Which means that people's posts are, by volume, 14% positive about the expansion, 41% neutral, and 45% negative.

Now, even allowing that negative posters post 85% more often than positive posters... We don't know how often neutral posters reply in response to the other two groups. But lets adjust for posting frequency on the positive side.

Here's the basic methodology:

Start off assuming 14 positive, 45 negative, and 41 neutral posts in a 100 post sample.

Adjust up the number of positive by 85% to allow for lower posting frequency.

You now have 26 positive, 45 negative, 41 neutral.

That brings the numbers around to:

40% negative. 23% positive. 37% neutral.

Now, yes, that means either way that negative posters are the minority. But the minority (especially a 40% one) is not strategically insignificant. It's not "break out the cake and to heck with the haters." It's serious sleeve rolling, coffee brewing, and pacing around the whiteboard time. And I'm sure they're already doing that but probably need to look at doing it more if 40% of your target for a free product is turned off by it.

I LIKE Cryptic's plan for the expansion overall. I like the ideas I'm seeing. I think it all stems from a good place, a place of creativity applied to dealing with challenges in game design. But I think that if they don't consider a few major changes, this is going to be a disappointment for them. The hole in the bucket is bigger than previously thought and it's time to get some really creative, adaptive brainstorming in, to let the criticism in and take it honestly and use it constructively. I don't expect Cryptic can just bend over backwards for every critic but I think these kinds of numbers really, really suggest the need for feedback and critical re-examination... and if they listen to Terilynn's dismissively calm take on this, they're going to wind up with a bruised lip and black eye in three months, taking a lot of this back to the drawing board.

If they treat it like an emergency now, it will save them money. You don't say:

- "Good news! My wife is only 40% sure she's going to divorce me!"
- "The doctor only gives me a 40% chance it's cancer!"
- "Revenue is down by a negligible 40% this quarter!"

You grit your teeth. You say, "We've got 60% we can work with." And you set out to understand, conquer, and convert as much of that remaining 40% that you can, while trying to electrify that 37% that's saying, "Meh. It's okay." (Because that's not great either.)
You're taking the first part of the article and basing all your assumptions on that, the point was that despite the number of negative posts, that it was essentially the same amount of people who were happy with the expansion but that they were shouting louder by posting more than the ones who were happy.
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 355
# 52
04-01-2013, 05:38 PM
Number of posts is irrelevant; individual posters is what matters. For this discussion anyway.

Although an internet forum is not a representative enough sample to make any conclusions anyway. Anybody who says "The majority loves it!" or "The majority hates it!" or "All true romulans think..." is making **** up.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 7,044
# 53
04-01-2013, 05:41 PM
Originally Posted by bluedarky View Post
You're taking the first part of the article and basing all your assumptions on that, the point was that despite the number of negative posts, that it was essentially the same amount of people who were happy with the expansion but that they were shouting louder by posting more than the ones who were happy.
Except, as I just explained, it's not essentially the same and it's an alarmingly large minority, even adjusting for frequency.

I just weighted for frequency and it's still 40% negative, 37% neutral, 23% positive.

40% negative is alarming. 37% neutral is troubling.

Cryptic's response should be... not panic... but reasonable alarm.

And I think people who try to calm them down from that aren't doing Cryptic or the game any favors. And devs who want to be calmer than that aren't doing themselves any favors.

It's not that I think the ideas on the table so far are bad. I suggested things very similar to most of them. I'm pretty darned happy with them. I know a lot of work has gone into them. But I think a strategy pow wow where ideas are flexible is absolutely warranted and that the "Meh! Things are fine!" take is a bit infuriating because it's that kind of thinking that usually winds up resulting in good work failing to be recognized or a complete success.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 209
# 54
04-01-2013, 05:43 PM
Originally Posted by pwebranflakes View Post
You don't need to -- just found out Teri actually did


Brandon =/\=
Interesting that they didn't go into anything regarding the validity of the negative posts and neutral posts nor did they comment on what expectations had been led to be prior to that clarification.

Then again Massively gets exclusives left and right and to do anything but help Cryptic discredit or diminish the folks who expressed constructive negative criticism isn't entirely unexpected.

I understand that obviously not many people replied negatively but I also know that Cryptic has repeatedly said that a very small minority of the playerbase even visits the forums or is even very informed about the goings on of the game. Now I'd love to see what would happen if a pop-up survey is introduced in the game for a once-per-account test...

I'd like to see the concerns and confusion and constructive posts addressed rather than have them dismissed.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 366
# 55
04-01-2013, 05:51 PM
Originally Posted by seekerkorhil View Post
I have yet to see how Cryptic are going to encourage people to play as either Federation or Klingons when you can play as Romulan, get all the romulan ships etc and STILL get everything the Federation/Klingon would have gotten.
actually thats a great question, why would you want to play as a regular kdf or fed when if you align to thier faction you get everything they get PLUS all the extra romulan stuff UNLESS as seekerkoehil stated your fed/kdf characters get all the romulan extra stuff as well.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 7,044
# 56
04-01-2013, 05:58 PM
Again, I think including "off topic" posts in the percentage (especially apart from "neutral") is the big source of skew here.

It's like saying:

"We conducted a poll at the local zoo to gauge which Star Trek Captain is most preferred. 75% of the conversations we had were with giraffes and penguins who did not answer. Of the remaining 25%, 6% preferred Picard, 6% preferred Kirk, 4% preferred Sisko, 4% preferred Janeway, 3% had no strong opinion, 2% preferred Archer. There was a 2% margin of error. As you can see, it's impossible to know who the most popular Captain is and only a paltry 6% of respondents preferred Kirk."
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 586
# 57
04-01-2013, 06:07 PM
As much as I trust Cryptic here.. I can't stress the "Can't Say Much" thing cause that happened with KDF a lot. I just hope they are doing good.
R'tolves Will Spread Thier Peace and Will Prevail Over the Hostiles Who Dare Hurt Such A Isolationist Consitutional Monarchy!

Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,064
# 58
04-01-2013, 06:10 PM
Originally Posted by stoleviathan99 View Post
Again, I think including "off topic" posts in the percentage (especially apart from "neutral") is the big source of skew here.
Look at it like this:
Total number of separate accounts that posted in the thread: 194

Positive responses: 13.9% - 107 posts
Negative responses: 23.8% - 183 posts
Neutral responses: 15.2% - 117 posts

Off-topic responses: 47.1% - 363 posts
Ignore the percentages and offline posts.

183 negative, 107 positive, and 117 neutral posts.

Regardless about what side you are sitting on, the reality is that everyone is filled with "Star trek: Online" passion. We all have our loves and dislikes about this game. We are all driven to see "Star Trek: Online" succeed. Although we may not agree on certain issues, the game got 407 posts about the one topic we all love. "Stat Trek: Online".

I call that a win. I also see that as an opportunity.

Last edited by linyive; 04-01-2013 at 06:14 PM.
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 15
# 59
04-01-2013, 06:15 PM
The discussion about whether the majority is positive or negative is not helpful.
Both sides are big enough to be considered.
We should put our energy into possible solutions instead playing civil war.

my possible solutions

1.) if klingons are not profitable for the devs ...why not try kickstarter..this is the best plattform to solve this problem

2.) Do the "Choose your side"-Thing, but not let Romulans fly alliance ships and vice versa only as a temporary solution until you made enough content for the romulans and then break the bonds to the alliance and make them a full 100 % independent development help from the industrialized countries until they are fit enough to stand alone.

3.) Make a real thrird fraction with less content like the klings at launch and deliver content through patches

It is easy to complain or defend the policy of is better to mediate and contribute solutions
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 142
# 60
04-01-2013, 06:17 PM
The thing I'd like to know most about those who are upset and happy are how many of those upset are planning on being Romulan mains, and how many of those happy are FED/KDF simply planning on making a ROM alt?
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