Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,282
# 11
04-02-2013, 09:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daroska View Post
Aefvadh S'harien ch'Rihan Eisn!

Interestingly informative article and a nice start to Star Trek Online.
As a hopeful forecoming Reman player, would you know of any books
to guide me in the process of learning about their lore? So that I
might wisely roleplay one when Legacy of Romulus comes about anew?
Memory Beta might be useful. It's a Star Trek wiki that includes stuff from the books, video games, and other non-canon works.
"It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid."
-- Q
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 109
# 12
04-02-2013, 09:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daroska View Post
Aefvadh S'harien ch'Rihan Eisn!

Interestingly informative article and a nice start to Star Trek Online.
As a hopeful forecoming Reman player, would you know of any books
to guide me in the process of learning about their lore? So that I
might wisely roleplay one when Legacy of Romulus comes about anew?
There's also the Memory Alpha entry, which may help:

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Reman
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 109
# 13
04-03-2013, 09:39 PM
On the subject of ranks:

Diane Duane's Glossary version
Rank/Rihannsu word/Starfleet equivalent
Antecenturion or Subcenturion/erein/Ensign
Subcommander/erei'riov/Lieutenant Commander
Senior Centurion/enarrain/Commodore or Colonel
Commander/khre'riov/Commodore or Colonel

It should be noted that these definitions are not consistent with TOS onscreen evidence, nor with the books themselves. Ael was a Subcommander when she was captain of Bloodwing, she was promoted to Commander and given command of a Neutral Zone patrol fleet, which matches with the Romulan Commander from The Enterprise Incident being in charge of a similar force. Likewise, the Romulan Subcommander from Balance of Terror was captain of his ship, and the Romulan Commander frequently referred to her second in command, captain of her flagship, as Subcommander Tal. Likewise, Tafv, Ael's son, held the rank of Subcommander while he was captain of Bloodwing. Finally, it seems likely the Glossary entry for Commander was accidentally repeated for the rank of Senior Centurion, as in My Enemy, My Ally, Ael thinks of Recreation Cheif Harb Tanzer as a "Senior Centurion," an officer who has served many years and garnered much experience, but not climbed to the higher ranks of command. To address these discrepancies, and fit into STO's rank and level scheme, I submit a modified list below.

Rank/Rihannsu word/Starfleet equivalent
Antecenturion/erein/Ensign
Subcenturion/erain/Lieutenant
Centurion/ererein/Lieutenant Commander
Senior Centurion/enarrain/Commander
Subcommander/erei'riov/Captain
Commander/khre'riov/Rear Admiral

This is all premliminary, and I'm open to suggestions.

And for forms of address:

lhhei - madam
rekkhai - sir

Last edited by erikmodi; 04-03-2013 at 09:57 PM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 109
# 14
04-04-2013, 03:45 PM
As regards Remans (Havranssu):

Diane Duane credited Vulcans, especially early Vulcans, with far greater psychic powers than have been witnessed in canon. Part of the rift between Vulcans and what would become Rihannsu came when Orion pirates attacked Vulcan under the old "we come in peace, shoot to kill" guise. The Vulcans fought back, sometimes with telepathic powers, making pilots lock their ships on suicide courses or killing Orions with nightmares. After the Rihannsu left Vulan, telepathy was used to keep in communication with Vulcan, and the ships even used telekinetic techniques to accelerate their ships to near lightspeed. Once settled on ch'Rihan, the Rihannsu gradually lost these telepathic powers, to the point where the psi abilities of Vulcans were regarded with superstitious awe, as witnessed by Spock, Kirk, and McCoy's "Vulcan Death Grip" ruse in The Enterprise Incident.

Other sources have speculated that Remans are descended from Vulcans with psi abilities who migrated to ch'Rihan and ch'Havran, but were segregated and evolved very differently from the Rihannsu. As such, both Rihannsu and Havranssu are offshoots of the Vulcan species. It's possible that their psionic ability, coupled with exposure to the harsh effects of dilithium mining, may have caused them to evolve (or devolve, depending on one's perspective) at an accelerated rate.

The psi adepts were an invaluable resource to the Rihannsu during their travel, so it falls to question why they would exile them to dilithium mines. Perhaps, since most psi training was Vulcan in origin, the Rihannsu wanted to cast off the last vestiges of being Vulcan, and in so doing separated the psionically adept from the general populace. Psi adepts also suffered greatly during the journey, as many of the things they were called upon to do were extremely taxing, sometimes lethally so (in particular, the "bootstrap" method of psionically accelerating ship killed most of the adepts who performed the technique.) It is possible the Remans chose to isolate themselves, as a sort of well-deserved class "vacation" from serving the Rihannsu people during the flight.

It is also a question of if the Havransu immediately began being forced to mine dilithium. The ships that left Vulcan were sublight, and warp drive eluded the Rihannsu for quite some time (according to Diane Duane's novels, they didn't get warp dive until they destroyed their first Federation starship, though Enterprise seems to indicate they possessed warp drive at least as early as humanity.) The Havranssu may have started their evolutionary divergence before they were pressed into slave labor in the dilitihium mines, or the isolated colony of psi adepts may have been exploited as a workforce when the Rihannsu discovered dilithium and its usefulness.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 109
# 15
04-08-2013, 11:37 AM
Some useful links I've found elsewhere:

http://acad.sfi.org/courses/alien/doc/rocmanual.pdf

This document contains a passing reference to the Remans, referring to them as indigenous to Remus. That was my first thought upon seeing Nemesis as well, though I find the idea that they are evolved telepathic Vulcans more compelling.

http://www.omniglot.com/writing/romulan.htm

One handy Romulan dictionary with useful words and phrases.

http://www.angelfire.com/ma/HHirl/rdictionary.html

A more complete Romulan dictionary, fewer phrases but more standalone words.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Mar 2013
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# 16
04-15-2013, 11:41 AM
Looking at other references, I'm modifying the rank structure I'd posited above

Rank/Rihannsu Word/Starfleet Equivalent
Antecenturion/uhlan/Ensign
Subcenturion/erein/Lieutenant
Centurion/arrain/Lieutenant Commander
Senior Centurion/enarrain/Commander
Subcommander/ere'riov/Captain
Commander (Commander-General)/khre'riov/Commodore (Rear Admiral, Lower Half)
Wing Commander/aelae'riov/Rear Admiral (Rear Admiral, Upper Half)
Fleet Commander/galae'riov/Vice Admiral
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 629
# 17 Another source for you...
04-15-2013, 12:06 PM
As another source of Romulan society, heritage and military you might want to take a look at The Way of D'era by Last Unicorn Games. It is a sourcebook for pen-and-paper rp games set in the times of ST:TNG.

It includes a section I intend to use on a group called the Tal Diann (akin to a vast internal affairs division which maintains and monitors relations between the Star Command and the various fleets and which also serves as an intelligence branch attached to the Romulan military). It does not have the same level of power as the Tal Shiar, but commands more respect and is often at odds with the Tal Shiar's methods.

I picture the Tal Diann as like Starfleet Intelligence and the Tal Shiar is their Section31.

Whilst some of the info in my source would conflict with yours, much is very compatible... although mine suggests that Centurion is more an equivalent of Starfleet Captain and commands all but the smallest ships (which is where Commander comes in, with Sub-Commander being brought in to fill an operational need and Lieutenants are generally those in charge of departments with Sub-lieutenants and Uhlan beneath them).

Edit - One thing I did like from my source was a rank called Sector Admiral which is described as a "rover" amongst flag ranks, moving to areas where leadership is most needed for short periods of time, especially during a crisis or war. I feel this is what we Fed Admirals are doing, going into combat almost daily, so it might be nice for the top rank of the Romulans to show a bit of planning and be called what they are - Sector Admirals.

Do we know how Cryptic are naming ranks Romulan-side yet or not?

Last edited by drowrulesupreme; 04-15-2013 at 12:10 PM.
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# 18
04-15-2013, 12:26 PM
I haven't seen anything about what the official ranks in-game will be, but tried to work my rank structure to fit the leveling system in the game. Obviously, if Cryptic assigns Rihannsu words to their ranks, those will take be official.
Lt. Commander
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# 19
04-18-2013, 08:39 PM
Before the release of Star Trek III, Leonard Nimoy hosted a special called "Lenard Nimoy: Star Trek Memories," in which he discussed Star Trek the series and the first two movies, and hinted at the third.

In this special, Nimoy talks about the origin of the Vulcan Neck Pinch in the episode "The Enemy Within," in which a transporter accident splits Captain Kirk into two separate beings, one having all the Captain's positive qualities and one having all his negative ones. In a climactic confrontation between the two Kirks, Spock knocks out the evil Kirk. The script called for Spock to come up behind the evil Kirk and smack him over the head with the butt of his phaser, but Nimoy believed that an advanced race like the Vulcans would have a more civilized way to render someone unconscious. He posited that Vulcans have the ability to exert a kind of energy from their fingertips, and that this energy, when applied to certain pressure points on the neck and shoulder, would render someone unconscious. This became known among the Star Trek writers as the "FSNP," or "Famous Spock Neck Pinch."

The ability for Vulcans to emit "neural energy" for lack of a better term, from the fingers became the cornerstone of many abilities Vulcans exhibited in various Star Trek media. The Vulcan Mind Meld clearly uses this energy to let the Vulcan "plug in" to the recipient's nervous system. More interestingly, it is used in the "Vulcan Finger-Touching."

In Journey to Babel, when Sarek introduces his wife Amanda, he holds up his hand with the first two fingers extended, and she touched his outstretched fingers with her own. They repeat this gesture later in the episode. It is my belief that this is a Vulcan gesture of intimacy, sort of the equivalent or amalgam of a hug, peck on the cheek, or chaste kiss on the lips. The ability of Vulcans to emit neural energy from the fingertips would mean that Vulcans touching in this manner are exchanging neural energy.

In The Enterprise Incident, we see Spock and the Romulan Commander have an intimate moment by stroking each others hands with fingertips. . . once more exchanging neural energy. The scene is expanded on in Star Trek III: The Search For Spock. This, to me, is the Vulcan equivalent of "first base," a prelude to greater intimate contact.

It is my belief that, in addition to applying neural energy to render someone unconscious, or to interface with their nervous system to share thoughts, this neural energy can stimulate the nerve endings in the skin to generate pleasurable sensations, and this is essentially what happens during the various forms of Vulcan finger-touching. (Remember that it's not that Vulcans don't have emotions, or even that they don't feel emotions. . . they simply do not let emotions factor into decision making. It is logical to take pleasure in intimacy with another.)

While the Romulans have allowed their mental powers to atrophy, they retain the ability to exert the same neural energy. The Romulan Commander, when Spock initiates finger-touching, does not hesitate to respond, indicating that either she had studied Vulcan customs in this area, or that Romulans have similar rituals of intimacy.

While I used to think that the Romulan Commander had studied up on Vulcans to best seduce Spock, I find the idea that the scene is more a "we are not so different" moment more compelling. Even though the Travellers sought to cast off as much of being Vulcan as they could before they left, I doubt they'd get rid of something as biologically imperative as a passionate kiss.

While Romulans have let their telepathic abilities falter, Remans have developed their telepathic abilities beyond even what Vulcans are typically capable of. While they doubtless retain the same neural energy projection ability, who knows what capabilities they have developed with it?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,282
# 20
04-18-2013, 08:45 PM
I always preferred the theory that the Remans were a species indigenous to Remus and were gradually enslaved by the "new arrivals". I have trouble believing that Romulans could "evolve" into that so quickly.

@the fingertip kiss thing: I remember Tuvok did the same thing to his wife in "Bliss".
"It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid."
-- Q
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