Captain
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 4,278
# 241
04-04-2013, 02:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by erikmodi View Post
The Prime Directive only applies in the case of pre-warp civilizations. Once a species has discovered faster-than-light travel and begun to join the galactic community, the Federation can meddle all they want.
Episodes of both DS9 and Voyager have stated that Starfleet can't interfere with the Internal Policies of non Federation governments due to the Prime Directive, even if they have warp capability. It's murky and obviously was just used as plot device to create dramatic tension (i.e. What will the Emissary do? The Sisko is bound by his duty to Starfleet to NOT interfere with who becomes Kai!). But it is there to be referenced on screen. For what that's worth.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,475
# 242
04-04-2013, 02:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by erikmodi View Post
The Prime Directive only applies in the case of pre-warp civilizations. Once a species has discovered faster-than-light travel and begun to join the galactic community, the Federation can meddle all they want.
You may be confusing the Prime Directive with the rules for first contact.
Captain
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 546
# 243
04-04-2013, 03:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kirksplat View Post
You may be confusing the Prime Directive with the rules for first contact.
Or the other "Starfleet General Orders", of which the Prime Directive is General Order 1.

The orders vary in importance and penalty. For instance, don't cross #7. Unless you're Spock.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,627
# 244
04-04-2013, 03:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by royalsovereign View Post
Or the other "Starfleet General Orders", of which the Prime Directive is General Order 1.

The orders vary in importance and penalty. For instance, don't cross #7. Unless you're Spock.
Well... I'm a Vulcan. Close enough?

On a more serious note, I like the direction this expansion is going so far. Look forward to hearing more.
The Game of Houses (A Klingon fan-fic)

"Logic and War are old enemies"

Vice Admiral Soval - Commanding Officer, U.S.S. Bunker Hill
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by nynik View Post
I'm very disillusioned that Goatshark dodged any detail on how tech-sharing alliances will be justified. Particularly from the UFP perspective.

I specificaly want to understand the rationale that allows the Federation reconcile Prime Directive violations, namely,
  • Providing knowledge of technologies or science (TOS: "A Private Little War"; VOY: "Caretaker")
  • Taking actions to generally affect a society's overall development (TNG: "Who Watches The Watchers")
  • Taking actions which support one faction within a society over another (TOS: "The Omega Glory"; TNG: "Too Short a Season")
  • Helping a society escape the negative consequences of its own actions (VOY: "Time and Again", "Thirty Days")
  • Subverting or avoiding the application of a society's laws (TOS: "Wolf in the Fold"; TNG: "Justice")
  • Interfering in the internal affairs of a society (TNG: "Symbiosis", "Reunion", "Redemption", "Redemption II", "The Price"; DS9: "The Circle", "Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges"; VOY: "Thirty Days")
I apologise if this has already been covered in one of the hundreds of posts in this thread, but the Prime Directive primarily applies to Federation interfering by forcibly accelerating a less advanced society's development or exploitng weaker and/or more primitive civilazations for personal/Federation gain. Canon examples of assistance rendered or 'reasonable' tech-sharing are too numerous for me to count but a few examples stand out. Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country is the best exampple as the UFP gave the Klingon Empire worlds and resources, saving them from extinction (and likely exploitation by Romulans and other galactic opportunists). The two powers started sharing tech not long after, which was mutual (though not giving each other ships) that fueled technological advances for both sides.

TNG had a bunch of episodes wherin they offered aid (not weapons) to those in need, even making/providing replacement parts for damaged craft, fom Pakleds to Romulans.

So the situation as described, with Romulan players starting as Independants, the 'Survivors Faction' actually makes a lot of sense. Not being tied to D'Tan or Sela make your character a Wild Card. An Asset coveted by not just the two Romulan 'governments' but by the Klingons and Federation as well. The fact that the Choices you make influences the end game experience with regard to story and content has me excited and may even surpass what you gain in the short-term 'benefits' from the Alliances You Make.
Sarvour ShipyardsSarvour Shipyards
=@=Commodore Joshua Daniel Sarvour, S.C.E.
U.S.S. AKAGI NX-93347, Enterprise-class Battle Cruiser =@= U.S.S. T'KORA'S WRATH NX-110047, Odyssey-class Battle Cruiser

"There Ain't No Grave, Can Hold My Body Down..."
Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14
# 246
04-05-2013, 10:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoggymack22 View Post
Episodes of both DS9 and Voyager have stated that Starfleet can't interfere with the Internal Policies of non Federation governments due to the Prime Directive, even if they have warp capability. It's murky and obviously was just used as plot device to create dramatic tension (i.e. What will the Emissary do? The Sisko is bound by his duty to Starfleet to NOT interfere with who becomes Kai!). But it is there to be referenced on screen. For what that's worth.

The difference here is, they cannot do so uninvited. When a civilization invites them to become involved, and there is reasonable proof that becoming involved is the best course of action, the Federation will do so; elsewise, the Federation would still be limited to the Sirius Sector Block, territorially. Officially, the Romulan Star Empire is leaderless, and a break away government with a strong desire to reunify, culturally, with their vulcan (Federation founding member) progenitors, and a real plan for stability and direction (not to mention a clear and vocal leader, who studied under Spock, which means the Federation already became involved, since he was a member of the Federation Diplomatic Corps) has reached out to them in peace. The Federation will logically recognize the government that has a leader, over a group of armed military renegades with delusions of grandeur. Politically speaking, the Romulan Republic has more legitimacy than the Romulan Star Empire, as of the current year, what with the Emperess being held by an outside power. It is in the vital security interests of the Alpha and Beta Quadrants for the UFP to become involved.

Last edited by nieves; 04-05-2013 at 10:51 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,577
# 247
04-05-2013, 11:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nieves View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoggymack22
Episodes of both DS9 and Voyager have stated that Starfleet can't interfere with the Internal Policies of non Federation governments due to the Prime Directive, even if they have warp capability. It's murky and obviously was just used as plot device to create dramatic tension (i.e. What will the Emissary do? The Sisko is bound by his duty to Starfleet to NOT interfere with who becomes Kai!). But it is there to be referenced on screen. For what that's worth.
The difference here is, they cannot do so uninvited. When a civilization invites them to become involved, and there is reasonable proof that becoming involved is the best course of action, the Federation will do so; elsewise, the Federation would still be limited to the Sirius Sector Block. Officially, the Romulan Star Empire is leaderless, and a break away government with a strong desire to reunify, culturally, with their vulcan (Federation founding member) progenitors, and a real plan for stability and direction (not to mention a clear and vocal leader, who studied under Spock, which means the Federation already became involved, since he was a member of the Federation Diplomatic Corps) has reached out to them in peace. The Federation will logically recognize the government that has a leader, over a group of armed military renegades with delusions of grandeur. Politically speaking, the Romulan Republic has more legitimacy than the Romulan Star Empire, as of the current year, what with the Emperess being held by an outside power. It is in the vital security interests of the Alpha and Beta Quadrants for the UFP to become involved.

All through the Original Star Trek series, the famous 'Prime Directive' ONLY applied to primitive cultures that were still unaware of life on other worlds and/or had to interstellar space flight capability

(That's the only way you can explain TOS episodes like "Friday's Child"; where the Capellans were in fact primitive, yet the Federation was negotiating a Dilithium mining agreement offering social and technological aid. Obviously, either the Federation felt the need for Dilithium outweighed the Prime Directive; OR the Capellans had become aware and knew of life on other worlds before the Federation made contact. Also, from dialogue in this episode and also from the TOS episode "A Private Little War", it could be inferred that Star Fleet will send a representative to blend in, and survey the primitive culture for a time period, and then recommend whether or not to invoke the Prime Directive for the culture surveyed.)

In TNG the writers (IMO) retconned the Prime Directive to include ANY culture (aware of other life and space faring or not) that is not already a member of the Federation (which IMO is ridiculous as how do they then get new member worlds; or forge new trading and other alliances <--- Which IMO was ridiculous, but I remember Picard usually trotting out the tired old TNG Prime Directive speech in any episode that involved a non-member Federation race (and occasionally even Fed member worlds as 'they had the right to handle their internal affairs' too). Picard even invoked it when Gauron - as the new head of the Klingon High Council - whom Picard himself installed as part of his role as the klingon arbiter of succession - requested Federation aid in dealing with the Duras Sisters and their supporters whose claim to the Klingon leadership was ALSO rejected/denied by Picard.

IMO - the TNG retcon of the 'Prime Directive' has always been ridiculous; and it appears STO is taking the TOS version into account more then the TNG version.

In other words, because they are dealing with another space faring civilization at about the same technological level - the Federation and Star Fleet is free to do what they think will be in the best interests of the Federation.

I don't have an issue with that.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=91861979000&dateline=  1340755546
PWE Drone says, "Your STO community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Ensign
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 11
# 248
04-18-2013, 08:26 AM
I really hope, because not much has been said, that Romulans can join existing federation or KDF fleets supplementing those ranks while bringing their holdings, their tech and their abilities into already established fleets.
Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 375
# 249
04-28-2013, 01:10 AM
The whole Romulan faction story arc is just like Roddenberry used to script using real world news. It's true! Look at it they're trying to make you accept the idea of breakaway governments like in Libya, and Syria. It's the lazy that doesn't pick up on it. What to do with it? I dno
Lyndon Brewer: 20% chance to capture enemy ship for 60 seconds on successful use of boarding party.

cause sometimes its party time!
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:47 AM.