Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 13,077
# 21
04-12-2013, 07:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dummyname View Post
I've been doing alot of pvp lately and one thing I've noticed is people call for alphas and subnukes alot. I can't seem to find those skills on any bridge officers on the exchange and the BO trainer doesn't have it either and none of my friends can train it. I've spent the last week looking over every single BO on the exchange, am I missing something?

Can anyone here train it for me please?
People always be hating on the Engineers.
Vice Admiral Geist, Klingon Science Officer
V.S.S. Oracle, D'Kyr-class Science Vessel
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 991
# 22
04-12-2013, 08:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by virusdancer View Post
Did you know, that during any given 15 minute period of play - that you're going to experience at least 73% downtime on the five innate abilities provided by your career selection? That means at most...27% uptime.
Except that Tactical Initiative cuts the cooldowns of the other skills. When I run ISE, here's how that works out generally:

Blow left side generators. APA + FOMM + GDF, hit Tac Initiative. Blow left side transformer.

Clear out spheres and probes, kill right side cube

Blow right side generators. APA + FOMM + Tac Fleet, blow right side transformer.

Clear out spheres and probes. Hit Tac Initiative when available, have as much as I can ready for gateway.

Gateway: APA (if up) + FOMM (if up) + GDF. Disruptor/Phaser Lotus, take a big chunk right off the top. Get aggro. Proceed to not care and blow the hell out of gateway.

Tac Cube: Pop Tac captain skills as available. No need to save them up for another big alpha. Work Tac Cube down and kill it.

So, in 10-15 minutes, I'm using every Tactical captain skill at least twice, if not three times. In doing so, I've contributed substantially toward my team both clearing the mission and getting the optional with time to spare. Imagine multiple tactical captains doing this, and what that adds up to. Those skills matter very, very much.

Also, as you mentioned, and as any of the experienced PvP guys will tell you, stacking Tactical captain powers is the only way to kill a skilled player. You may need some Sub Nuc and hold help from a sci ship, but the Tac captain has to get the kill.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 13,077
# 23
04-12-2013, 09:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shockwave85 View Post
Except that Tactical Initiative cuts the cooldowns of the other skills.
I tried to present both sides, but I must admit I'm a little biased away from Tac. I have 4 Eng, 2 Sci, and 2 Tac...with LoR I'm planning to add 2 Sci.

Even with Tac Init, I still see an efficiency problem because of the emphasis on reducing the target to 0 as fast as possible can mean buff uptime is wasted. Definitely going to be more efficient on the Gate and Tac Cube...but everything else just pops so fast.

Though, the efficiency comment - can definitely be seen as off, lol. Just ran an ISE where I didn't need RSF, MW, nor did anybody need me to drop out Eng Fleet. Held aggro on anything I looked at even with Sensor Targeting Assault and did ~35% (or more, damn combat log doesn't write plasma correctly) of the damage (no FAW - but yeah, Beam Arrays). So that's an extreme example of lack of efficiency...not even needing three of them...meh.

In the end though, I wish Careers actually mattered more. That there were passives that modified different aspects - that the innate abilities were balanced based on that - as well as reviewed for their overall effectiveness both in a solo and team environment.
Vice Admiral Geist, Klingon Science Officer
V.S.S. Oracle, D'Kyr-class Science Vessel
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,318
# 24
04-12-2013, 09:40 AM
I got around this with another account. I can then pass my boffs around to my own characters for relevent training, without the need for anyone else

Fed: Eng (Five) Sci (Maelrock) Tac (Shen) Rom: Sci (Mervek)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kitsune424 View Post
Here is your ticket to the USS Stupidity, Third class, four tacks on the chair, rules state you MUST sit on the chair, no standing, or hovering above the tacks, thank you have a nice day
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,473
# 25
04-12-2013, 10:02 AM
Bit of a close-minded post, and the premise smacks of inexperience.

You miss the most important factor: the player.

Good players who know how to set up a ship to optimize abilities will always stand out over average players. DPS and Ultra Rare consoles be damned. Kim Jon Un has nuclear missiles, but can't hit squat.

----

Yes, boffs can gain access to other Lt. Command and Commander skills.

Base captains (Tac, Sci & Eng.) have skills you can't give to boffs. So no, character class does have value.

While DPS alone does win the day in some STF's, in recent new STF's the presence of Sci and & Engineering Captains speed the win. The best example is HOS elite; 2 science captains are recommended. In any combat, have a healer or someone who can drop shields is always a huge bonus.

PvE missions - I'd rather a Sci or Eng Captain. PvP is more challenging, but Sci captains can win with brains.
HAIL HYDRA! Kirk's Protege 10/26/13 http://www.dtfleet.com
Ensign
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 11
# 26
04-12-2013, 10:33 AM
yea i had a guy take my boff when i asked him to train him for me. Man was i pissed
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,000
# 27
04-12-2013, 11:42 AM
Well to be honest tactical or science is the only way to roll at the moment. Eng is ok but there's nothing they bring to the table you need.

Now I'm by no means this good: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYzNd...ature=youtu.be

but we tend to do it well between 6-7 mins but my fleet has designs on hitting 3:30 mins (Part of the fleet Horror from the vid is in) possibly less.

Also Virus you say wasted efficiency of captain skills but if you didn't manage to kill your target by the time Sensor Scan or EPS+nadeon ran out then they were less efficient/effective anyway. APA and/or FOMM allowed you to kill it faster and move on allowing you greater time to deal with a new threat or more enemies.

Yes other skills are defensive and help you and your team live longer but I can honestly say that 90% of people I make the effort to help out with the AoE defence abilities when a team mate needs it they hit evasive and run away where the entire ability is wasted as I didn't need it -.-
Commander
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 392
# 28
04-12-2013, 10:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddesjardins View Post
Bit of a close-minded post, and the premise smacks of inexperience.

You miss the most important factor: the player.

Good players who know how to set up a ship to optimize abilities will always stand out over average players. DPS and Ultra Rare consoles be damned. Kim Jon Un has nuclear missiles, but can't hit squat.

----

Yes, boffs can gain access to other Lt. Command and Commander skills.

Base captains (Tac, Sci & Eng.) have skills you can't give to boffs. So no, character class does have value.

While DPS alone does win the day in some STF's, in recent new STF's the presence of Sci and & Engineering Captains speed the win. The best example is HOS elite; 2 science captains are recommended. In any combat, have a healer or someone who can drop shields is always a huge bonus.

PvE missions - I'd rather a Sci or Eng Captain. PvP is more challenging, but Sci captains can win with brains.
Knowing how to use your officer class, is requirement for all.

The few things bring special to the table, are miniscule compared tot he BOff abilities you can recieve, vs your skill point decisions in your skill tree.

Been experimenting with a Tac Officer as of late, dominant focus is sci abilities for the BOffs, just as i"ve been focusing on an Eng with a Tac emphasis.

So far, compared to my Sci/Sci characters, and my Tac/Tac toons, aside from the couple skills soly for their classes at the player level, there is hardly any difference at all between any of them in regards to effect in their specific roles.

My Tac/Sci set up, is producing the same DPS with a Gravity Well III as my Sci/Sci set up. Photonic Shockwave, and Viral Matrix are just as effective as well.

My Eng/Tac build, is producing 14k DPS by end of game just as my tac/tac is.

I'm finding no difference at all even worth discussing between mixed crossed/opposite classed toons.

The biggest impacts, are BOff abilities, and skill point distribution in the skill tree.
Commander
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 435
# 29
04-13-2013, 06:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by benovide View Post
You can always find a friend who has a Sci/Eng/Tac who can train the Bridge Officer in that Rapid Fire 3, HY3, GW3, etc. etc. and trade it back to you.

I had the most ignorant conversation ever with a player, who went on and on how Tacs are the only viable because of skills they can train their Tac BOffs in.

Here's a little reality check for you guys, there is always a Sci, Eng, Tac who is willing to, either for EC, or as a favor, train your BOff in a skill only they can train, and trade it back to you.

I'm an Engineer, and both of my Tac Officers have level 3 skills in several areas thanks to Tac Players I'm buds with. I have Sci with Gravity Well 3.

I have a Tac bud of mine that has emergency power to shields 3, etc.

you kinda missed the whole point: no-one ever complained about the boff training.

The complaint was that tac captains can buff their damage to ridiculous heights while the others get to do jack ****.

Engineer captains prime ability, RSF got stleath nerfed when the 75% resist limit was introduced, combined with a LACK of any sort of upper limit on damage, tac captain can still plow right throw fully buffed shields so the whole engineering perk becomes pointless.

Sci captains suffered from a general lack of potency in their skills.

Holo fleet neither tanks or does it dps. its a distraction that is easily cleared by one faw or spread or scatter volley. In essence its a wasted skill.

Snuggle field, snb and sensor scan remain useful for teams as well as science fleet. But still it seriously lacks synergy with the sci profession.



The Tac synergy is: guns and buffs to guns. (oh and also to anything else that does damage because clearly a tac captain knows how to make a more destructive gravity well.... or warp plasma...)


Engineers get no synergy at all. Their skills do what other skills already do, and without long cool downs.


Sci officers get limited synergy in the sense that sensor scan and SNB degrade defenses on a target. But compared to the sheer firepower a tac captain brings to any build, sci do not really stand a chance. The are in essence snb and scan whores.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,474
# 30
04-13-2013, 06:15 AM
Tacticals have the best skills? Pfft. Try setting your saintly feet on the dirt, and see how long it takes you to come crying to the engineers for artillery or to the medics for heals.
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