Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 27
# 101
04-19-2013, 11:48 AM
I feel that the singularity powers in no way make up for a permanent -40 to power levels. Singularity has to be charged up to level 3 at least before it's even worth using, that's time spent, on top of that, once used, you can't even begin to start charging it up again for.... 20 seconds? (Can't remember and suffering constant "server not responding" atm)

Constant lower weapon power = always doing less damage.
Constant lower shield power = less shield regen and resistance.
Constant lower engine power = terrible turn rate and lower defence %
Constant lower aux power = less effective sci heals / damage.

All those negatives for a few (somewhat gimmicky) powers, that you can choose to use just one of, every 45s to a minute maybe?

I'd like the option to not even bother with the core. Perhaps the cores themselves should have the -10 to all systems stats on them. That way we could choose to use them and suffer the power loss, or remove them and lose the powers. Course, wouldn't really be a romulan ship without it though, would it?

I can honestly see me just using ships from the faction I ally with as a result.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,984
# 102
04-19-2013, 11:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
Ships like the Defiant and Galaxy-R with their too many Ensign Tactical or Ensign Eng stations have had these running, repeated, complaints.

Ships with awful turn rates with repeated, running complaints.



I thought perhaps that problem would die with the old ships, that they were basically beyond saving in the current business plan of "what's next and new?"

I reconciled with that. It's a business model, and this is a business after-all.



To see those same, almost universally derided and reviled, design choices such as 6 or lower turnrates or too many Tac Ensign stations (Andorian, The Romulan T'Varo) or too many Ensign Eng stations (D'Deridex) is really just mind-boggling.
ok, theres like NO similarity between having 3 tac ENS and 3 eng ENS. any escort that isn't hurr durr 4 cannons can use the 3rd ENS seamlessly, especially if you use torps, HY1 is a great skill. i dont really understand the complaining about the tac andorian ship, its supposed to be a deep compromise using the version with 5 tac consoles. the other 2 are perfectly normal, with the hugly powerful 5th forward weapon.

the T'Varo, if i recall correctly, had the armatige station setup with a universal instead of sci LT. and an enhanced battle cloak. thats a great station setup, pared with a very overpowered given its stats ability.

3 sci, well theres so many different system cooldowns in sci at ENS that thats not an issue at all.

NOTHING is worse then having 3 eng ENS, of course made worse by the worst station power change in the history of the game, to the EPt skills. on ships that dont have better then a single LTC eng, a 3rd ENS is ok, but ships with a commander and 2 LTC level eng powers, there is no good, or even ok build that can be made with that, now more then ever.



the decision with the D'Deridex, i sense geko behind it. i dont know how they could have missed all the galaxy R is horrible threads. they seem obsessed with making tier 4 ships, for cruisers and kinda escorts, cursed with this insane over specialization. it only EVER made sense on the defiant, to have that much tac, and little else. the galaxy is IN CANON the most versatile ship, with the largest and most powerful phaser arrays of any canon federation ship. being a versatile ship means universal stations, why isn't that obvious?! yet its the least versatile, wimpiest ship in the entire game. how dare you get THAT ship, of all ships, that wrong devs.

and now the d'deridex. with these cruiser stats you devs are serial killer of canon. your design goal for them to only be heal boat support ships is WRONG. your design goal for the smallest ships to be the only thing that deals damage is WRONG. not pandering to cruiser fans, as in all star trek fans, is FINANCIALLY WRONG.
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 716
# 103
04-19-2013, 12:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsurutafan01 View Post
Romulans not having a science ship is something that had me scratching my head too. They've always been portrayed as devious but intelligent, and with science to a level in the ballpark of the Federation.
I've always seen Gorn portrayed as "brute force", or using "push-it-till-it-moves" technology, but apparently in STO they are the KDF's Science & Technology species.

Also, I've always seen the Orions as sly tricksters, something that would probably support Science-based style of buffing/debuffing. But again, in STO, they are instead wielders of the heavy, slow cruiser tanks.

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Last edited by direphoenix; 04-19-2013 at 12:04 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 635
# 104
04-19-2013, 12:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by archoncryptic View Post
We'll have more info up on this very soon.
Good to hear. With so few shuttle related content, it's more of an immersian thing, but it's still nice to have.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 651
# 105
04-19-2013, 12:06 PM
Ah, things never change on Tribble - they ask for feedback on ships, and 95% of the feedback is for something that is a perceived flaw in something they have not even tested. Good times!

Now, for some feedback on things that I HAVE tested:
* The interior is awsome looking, but as per usual it feels like it could not actually fit inside the ship, and it has a bunch of weird corridors that twist and turn for no apparent reason. Why not make the interior more like the Belfast bridge, where everything is compact and there isn't a ton of empty space, at least on the smaller ships?
* I another post I mentioned that the Romulan ships didn't feel different enough from Fed/KDF ones - after reading the dev posts here, I need to retract that. The T'Liss felt slower and more ungainly than I remembered a T1 ship feeling, and that now makes sense after reading Archon's post about lower overall power levels. I can get behind that plan, it makes you adjust your tactics and really have to make use of the singularity core. I think you can probably come up with some other differentiation factors as well, but that is a good start.
* The T'Liss' cannon hardpoints are a bit close together for my taste - it was hard to tell my Dual Cannons from my turret firing. It might look a little better if they were spread a bit further apart.
* There appeared to be green impulse engines along the top back edge of the T'liss' main hull (the same as were in the dorsal fin), but they are only visible from a certain angle - like the mesh is missing an opening that should be there. The ones on the fin also seemed to appear and disappear depending on the viewing angle. If I had my druthers, the ones on the fin should be the only ones needed, and they would be more prominently visible. The ship is small, the design is old, and the maneuverability not great - small impulse engines fit that description.
* The crew on the T'Liss seems a bit large for such a small ship. The NX-class was a comparable size, and it had half the crew of the ship as it stands.

I think that's all I have for rignt now. I will get you more feedback on the Dhalen once I have had more time to play it.
So, I am sitting alongside a Caitian Atrox Carrier at Earth Spacedock, and I think to myself "Man, that ship has a lot of windows".

Then it occurs to me that it makes a lot of sense, because cats love to sit in windows.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 106
04-19-2013, 12:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by archoncryptic View Post
I appreciate your enthusiasm, but many of the stats on the ships above level 20 are placeholder. Our current testing is focused on levels 1-20 because that's what's ready to test.

We are actively monitoring these feedback threads and we are listening to player concerns.
Fair enough, and it is enthusiasm for this game that does keep me posting here and testing, and providing feedback.

So thanks for recognizing that, I know I can get a bit too enthusiastic at times.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
ok, theres like NO similarity between having 3 tac ENS and 3 eng ENS. any escort that isn't hurr durr 4 cannons can use the 3rd ENS seamlessly, especially if you use torps, HY1 is a great skill. i dont really understand the complaining about the tac andorian ship, its supposed to be a deep compromise using the version with 5 tac consoles. the other 2 are perfectly normal, with the hugly powerful 5th forward weapon.

I agree that 3 Ensign Eng is worse.

3 Ensign tac isn't so much about making use of the Tac, it's the lack of other things that make other ships simply better options every, single time.

5th Forward weapon is not as big a deal as people make it out to be, all of the worries of the Andorian being OP in PvP - and that ship went out with a whimper.

How many of these do you actually see show up in PvP that put out a good performance, how many of those are the Tac Version with the extra Tac Lt?

That BOFF layout is excessively poor, and 5 Tac consoles does not make up for that.

Again, as with the Defiant - it's pretty much a given that the Sci and Eng versions of the Andorian with their 1 less Tac Console are leaps and bounds better due to the simply better build options that 1 Lt gives.


Last edited by ussultimatum; 04-19-2013 at 01:17 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 651
# 107
04-19-2013, 12:21 PM
BTW, ArchonCryptic - very nice work overall. Don't let the negative nellies get you down, and don't give in to people who what you to give up on actual game design because they are unable to develop new styles of play. That happens far too often in STO, and the result is everything feeling the same no matter what you play.

I get the feeling that once people figure out how to use their cloaks and singularity powers to develop tactics to fight like Romulans rather than Feds and Klingons, things will work out just fine with the lower power levels.
So, I am sitting alongside a Caitian Atrox Carrier at Earth Spacedock, and I think to myself "Man, that ship has a lot of windows".

Then it occurs to me that it makes a lot of sense, because cats love to sit in windows.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 108
04-19-2013, 12:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
ok, theres like NO similarity between having 3 tac ENS and 3 eng ENS. any escort that isn't hurr durr 4 cannons can use the 3rd ENS seamlessly, especially if you use torps, HY1 is a great skill. i dont really understand the complaining about the tac andorian ship, its supposed to be a deep compromise using the version with 5 tac consoles. the other 2 are perfectly normal, with the hugly powerful 5th forward weapon.

the T'Varo, if i recall correctly, had the armatige station setup with a universal instead of sci LT. and an enhanced battle cloak. thats a great station setup, pared with a very overpowered given its stats ability.

3 sci, well theres so many different system cooldowns in sci at ENS that thats not an issue at all.

NOTHING is worse then having 3 eng ENS, of course made worse by the worst station power change in the history of the game, to the EPt skills. on ships that dont have better then a single LTC eng, a 3rd ENS is ok, but ships with a commander and 2 LTC level eng powers, there is no good, or even ok build that can be made with that, now more then ever.



the decision with the D'Deridex, i sense geko behind it. i dont know how they could have missed all the galaxy R is horrible threads. they seem obsessed with making tier 4 ships, for cruisers and kinda escorts, cursed with this insane over specialization. it only EVER made sense on the defiant, to have that much tac, and little else. the galaxy is IN CANON the most versatile ship, with the largest and most powerful phaser arrays of any canon federation ship. being a versatile ship means universal stations, why isn't that obvious?! yet its the least versatile, wimpiest ship in the entire game. how dare you get THAT ship, of all ships, that wrong devs.

and now the d'deridex. with these cruiser stats you devs are serial killer of canon. your design goal for them to only be heal boat support ships is WRONG. your design goal for the smallest ships to be the only thing that deals damage is WRONG. not pandering to cruiser fans, as in all star trek fans, is FINANCIALLY WRONG.
Although I agree with you, it's probably pointless to give feedback on this issue and beat the dead horse. The thread with 23k hits and 800 posts about Galaxy-r / the fail of 3 engineering slots was thouroughly ignored, so it's not likely they will change their minds anyway.

Maybe we aren't just smart enough to after close to 3 years in STO figure out the awesomeness of toothless "tank ship" with 3 engineering ensign layout - in a game, where tanks are not needed and all content is solved by dps class in so called "glass cannon" ships.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,489
# 109
04-19-2013, 12:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by direphoenix View Post
I've always seen Gorn portrayed as "brute force", or using "push-it-till-it-moves" technology, but apparently in STO they are the KDF's Science & Technology species.

Also, I've always seen the Orions as sly tricksters, something that would probably support Science-based style of buffing/debuffing. But again, in STO, they are instead wielders of the heavy, slow cruiser tanks.
Orions as sly, and tricky, but their tools are economic and political. Why would they even consider a fair fight with guns and stuff when they can just subvert somebody else into fighting their battles while seeming uninvolved.

Gorn in Trek have... a rather inconsistent presentation.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 716
# 110
04-19-2013, 12:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by raptor63549 View Post
I just realized something: I don't remember seeing any free romulan shuttles.

Is the scorpion which is a paid ship the only romulan small craft avalable? Very disapointing if true. We have seen Romulan shuttles on DS9, so there's no excuse.


Also: regarding science vessels, we have seen Romulan Scout ships on TNG. Add that in as well.
I would think that we should get that Romulan Runabout-equivalent (the one with the BSG Centurion face), since that's what we escape the colony with to dock with our TOS BoP.

*side note: in the cutscene, it seems like that Romulan Runabout needs seats at the control panels. Standing controls for a small craft would be awkward without having something to hold on to. I mean, ye olde sailing vessels had helms where you stand, but you could at least hang on to the wheel when the ship is rocking about. Can't really do that when the controls are a flat console.

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