Captain
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 5,394
# 171
05-04-2013, 10:40 PM
It's not going to be the Romulan version of the excelsior.

And it can't turn more than 5 base.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,260
# 172
05-05-2013, 01:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hasukurobi View Post
(...)
But Cryptic, PLEASE, you are splashing the face of that War Bird on all your adds, it is the most Iconic Romulan ship out there, it is THE Face of Romulan power, do NOT make it suck so hard that flying it makes you feel guilty because you know it is just for looks and no substance.
Two words: Galaxy Class?

EDIT: And I don't mean that the Galaxy should be the best ship or the most capable, but it IS maybe the most iconic ship in the whole franchise. And it sucks in an embarassing way. And they did that for each and every one of the big cruisers, be it Fed, Klingon or now Romulan.
-> STO players unite and say NO to ARC <- -> Click if you prefer the old forum design! <-
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh

Last edited by angrytarg; 05-05-2013 at 01:05 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,203
# 173
05-05-2013, 01:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoggymack22 View Post
It's not going to be the Romulan version of the excelsior.

And it can't turn more than 5 base.
Well thats why we are making threads like this trying to convince the devs to change the sorry state this ship is currently in. Do you have something to add to the discussion as to why or why not it shouldn't be changed or what changes you would like to see?

I don't see the point in making a battelcloaking ship unable to carry out ambushes due to lack of firepower myself. The bad turn can be handled with battlecloak and RCS, but it needs more tac consoles and Lt Cmdr Tac boff to make the battlecloak it gives up turn and power levels for to even be worht having
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,362
# 174
05-05-2013, 01:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoggymack22 View Post
It's not going to be the Romulan version of the excelsior.

And it can't turn more than 5 base.
I got the retrofit version to turn at 13, and cloaked 30.


Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,013
# 175
05-05-2013, 02:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoggymack22 View Post
It's not going to be the Romulan version of the excelsior.

And it can't turn more than 5 base.
Quote:
Originally Posted by neoakiraii View Post
I got the retrofit version to turn at 13, and cloaked 30.
Like I said, I saw the REGULAR D'deridex do a U-turn within seconds, far more effectively than my Defiant ever could. WITHOUT CLOAKING.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
And I don't pretend to understand them.
Ensign
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 18
# 176
05-05-2013, 02:28 AM
I do think that if anything its a content design issue. There is nothing wrong with cruisers in the abstract and the galaxy is the logical layout for a cruiser at the point in the game you get it. What people complain about are just the downsides of a cruiser. Cruiser upside is big hull and lots of crew to repair hull, good shields, reasonable DPS (between that of an escort and a science vessel). Downside is that it maneuvers poorly and the DPS is not top-notch.

In the abstract there is nothing at all wrong with ship design in the game. Escort Top DPS/Turn, worst shield output/crew, mid hull. Cruiser best hull/crew, mid DPS/shields, low turn. Science ship is Worst DPS/hull, best shields, mid turn/crew.

The problem lies in content design where most content favors high DPS and maneuverability. Create meaningful content that favors tanking ability and moderate DPS and cruisers become viable.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,329
# 177
05-05-2013, 02:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by angrytarg View Post
Two words: Galaxy Class?

EDIT: And I don't mean that the Galaxy should be the best ship or the most capable, but it IS maybe the most iconic ship in the whole franchise. And it sucks in an embarassing way. And they did that for each and every one of the big cruisers, be it Fed, Klingon or now Romulan.
That is a sad truth... Exxxceeept... For the Klingons the Vor'Cha was one of their big standards for a long while and that one is actually quite viable. It is not the best but it is not too shabby and the Mirror one is really nice. The Negh'var is pretty strongly "eh" though... Not as bad as the others but close...


Quote:
Originally Posted by azazel420 View Post
I do think that if anything its a content design issue. There is nothing wrong with cruisers in the abstract and the galaxy is the logical layout for a cruiser at the point in the game you get it. What people complain about are just the downsides of a cruiser. Cruiser upside is big hull and lots of crew to repair hull, good shields, reasonable DPS (between that of an escort and a science vessel). Downside is that it maneuvers poorly and the DPS is not top-notch.

In the abstract there is nothing at all wrong with ship design in the game. Escort Top DPS/Turn, worst shield output/crew, mid hull. Cruiser best hull/crew, mid DPS/shields, low turn. Science ship is Worst DPS/hull, best shields, mid turn/crew.

The problem lies in content design where most content favors high DPS and maneuverability. Create meaningful content that favors tanking ability and moderate DPS and cruisers become viable.
Keep in mind we are talking the Galaxy R or Fleet Galaxy NOT the lower level Galaxy here...

The Galaxy, and likely this ship if it stays as is, will be generating LESS DPS than most Science Vessels due to such heavy amounts of Engineering BOFFs and low Tactical Consoles. In the meantime that big hull and healing is somewhat irrelevant considering that Escorts can easily tank the most vicious enemies in the game and still thoroughly trounce your DPS. Also: Why would a D'deridex be concerned with having a big tank to begin with? It is a top-notch war ship for a species who's strategy tends to be only fighting when they have the advantage. Pop out of cloak, murder your victim, and re-cloak before they get a chance to even shoot back. That sort of ship does not need huge tank it needs huge guns.

Also Cryptic seems to have trouble with the idea of enemies that fight hard enough to make Tank useful without just OHKing everything regardless of its stats. It is all-or-nothing with them for some reason.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 523
# 178
05-05-2013, 03:08 AM
The D'deridex has lt tac, ensign tac, commander eng, ltcmd sci and lt universal.


AWESOME!


Screw your bloody tac console's!!!


I love that boff layout and what would ido with 5 tac consoles anway. there is so much CHEESE in console form i wanna put on this hunk that tac consoles are the least of my priorities....

What is important is the boff seating, and its GOOD.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,260
# 179
05-05-2013, 04:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by azazel420 View Post
I do think that if anything its a content design issue. There is nothing wrong with cruisers in the abstract and the galaxy is the logical layout for a cruiser at the point in the game you get it. What people complain about are just the downsides of a cruiser. Cruiser upside is big hull and lots of crew to repair hull, good shields, reasonable DPS (between that of an escort and a science vessel). Downside is that it maneuvers poorly and the DPS is not top-notch.

In the abstract there is nothing at all wrong with ship design in the game. Escort Top DPS/Turn, worst shield output/crew, mid hull. Cruiser best hull/crew, mid DPS/shields, low turn. Science ship is Worst DPS/hull, best shields, mid turn/crew.

The problem lies in content design where most content favors high DPS and maneuverability. Create meaningful content that favors tanking ability and moderate DPS and cruisers become viable.
While I do agree that the game basically is a casual lunch break shooter which screws everything but DPS dealers, I do heavily disagree that there is nothing wrong with how ships are handled.

But this is a more principal issue. Star Trek ships just don't work the way this game forces them to work. There are actually no "roles" for Starfleet vessels as each and every one of them is a multi-purpose ship (except two or three dedicated designs: Sovereign, Oberth and Olympic) which should be reflected in the game. As such, Federation ships should have more universal stations and more all-round console slots (though the "console" system is flawed in the first place). Especially the Galaxy class does not deserve to be just a tank - if any ship would deserve three basic refits (tac, eng, sci) it would be the galaxy and not that... thing... they did for STO.

What would work wuite well - without reworking the entire game, would be Galaxy refits for tac, sci or eng purposes. The fleet galaxy being the ENG variant while the d'deridex became what tac or sci galaxies should look like. The warbird, on the other hand, should not be a engineering heavy vessel by any means. It's a warship - Starfleet vessels aren't. The basc principle should be a tac heavy d'deridex with a science boost while klingons should basically have tac heavy ships with a engineering boost and Starfleet should be the most versatile. And that's probably the biggest flaw: IF you have to press Star Trek into the primitive ruleset of an fantasy-MMO, STO got it all wrong and that what's causing all the "beef" with their ship designs
-> STO players unite and say NO to ARC <- -> Click if you prefer the old forum design! <-
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,700
# 180
05-05-2013, 04:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoggymack22 View Post
Give up on the D'Deridex. It's slated to be the Ticklebeam Cloakboat that the REAL Romulans make fun of as we pew pew pew right past it in our Mogais.
I think that the whole point of the multiple voices now being heard is that folks didn't fight for the Galaxy , and they are regretting that now ... , and they see the D'Deridex as a second chance for that fight that should have been had (and won) in the first place .

3 Tac consoles will not make this ship OP .
It will not even blur the lines between the fire power of the d'Deridex and the fire power of the Guramba for example , as the Guramba has a far more tactical Boff layout .
STO will be out of Beta in another 2-4 years ???
... you know after another 3 story arc remasters, crafting revamp, skills revamp, PVP upgrade ...
*note : the 2-4 year guesstimate came out of comparing Cryptic's Dev speed and that of a snail . Sadly the snail won .

Last edited by aelfwin1; 05-05-2013 at 04:52 AM.
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