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Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,273
# 31
04-22-2013, 12:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by skyranger1414 View Post
I think what's really interesting about it all is that somehow a lot of the KDF players have anger issues towards the feds..... feds that are in no way responsible for Cryptic letting the KDF stagnate. Its almost like they're angry and mad at players for NOT wanting to play KDF more, even with better consoles, better doffing, and better cruisers.
You've touched on a point of irritation.

There are Federation players who would rather have KDF exclusives (the exclusives that keep the factions from being homogenous) added to the Federation, rather than PLAY as KDF. For the longest time, Federation players have complained about their cruisers not having dual cannons, and how they don't have built-in cloaks, and about the several useful consoles the KDF has exclusively.

The Federation has already obtained several KDF exclusives as it is. They got access to carriers. They have a cruiser that can cloak, it's just 'not good enough' for them. They have RETAINED their traditional advantages in STO, that being the edge in escorts and their science ship line, and I don't see them in any hurry to give these advantages to the KDF.

Far too many outspoken Fed players seem to be 'take take take', without a care given to retaining differences between factions, and keeping a semblance of balance PvP-wise. We don't like it when Cryptic listens to these greedy players, and then neglects the KDF as they've done in the past.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,251
# 32
04-22-2013, 12:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
You've touched on a point of irritation.

There are Federation players who would rather have KDF exclusives (the exclusives that keep the factions from being homogenous) added to the Federation, rather than PLAY as KDF. For the longest time, Federation players have complained about their cruisers not having dual cannons, and how they don't have built-in cloaks, and about the several useful consoles the KDF has exclusively.

The Federation has already obtained several KDF exclusives as it is. They got access to carriers. They have a cruiser that can cloak, it's just 'not good enough' for them. They have RETAINED their traditional advantages in STO, that being the edge in escorts and their science ship line, and I don't see them in any hurry to give these advantages to the KDF.

Far too many outspoken Fed players seem to be 'take take take', without a care given to retaining differences between factions, and keeping a semblance of balance PvP-wise. We don't like it when Cryptic listens to these greedy players, and then neglects the KDF as they've done in the past.
Indeed, I play both factions somewhat equally and I would rather see them both (well three very soon) stay unique offering players a unique gameplay experience (and unique items) rather than everything being available on one faction. It doesn't matter the method in which one can acquire these other faction items, the fact that they can is the problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by macronius View Post
Cryptic is sloppy. Breaking News at 11. This is what happens when there is no outline or plan and you just make up **** as you go along.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shredder75 View Post
We can tell our great grandchildren, "In my day, our cloaks were so sensitive that even dialogue broke them and we couldn't change our clothes!"
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 262
# 33
04-22-2013, 03:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
You've touched on a point of irritation.

There are Federation players who would rather have KDF exclusives (the exclusives that keep the factions from being homogenous) added to the Federation, rather than PLAY as KDF. For the longest time, Federation players have complained about their cruisers not having dual cannons, and how they don't have built-in cloaks, and about the several useful consoles the KDF has exclusively.

The Federation has already obtained several KDF exclusives as it is. They got access to carriers. They have a cruiser that can cloak, it's just 'not good enough' for them. They have RETAINED their traditional advantages in STO, that being the edge in escorts and their science ship line, and I don't see them in any hurry to give these advantages to the KDF.

Far too many outspoken Fed players seem to be 'take take take', without a care given to retaining differences between factions, and keeping a semblance of balance PvP-wise. We don't like it when Cryptic listens to these greedy players, and then neglects the KDF as they've done in the past.
Very well said. I prefer playing 2 Unique factions each with it's unique feeling. In the past Cryptic regretably happy gave away many of the KDF exlusives.
Cryptic's shamefull history with the KDF

http://www.stowiki.org/User:Peregrin...ryptic_Studios
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,037
# 34
04-22-2013, 04:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by number1romulan View Post
Exactly - Romulans supplied and taught the KDF how to use cloaking tech - some 50-100 years after they developed it.

It is just a logical thing to say that the Romulans have superior knowledge about cloaks and their use.
That someone originated an idea does not automatically mean he's best at it.

For example:
The British invented the tank in WW1.
The French invented the modern tank (Renault FT-17) with single rotaing turret.
Yet in WW2 the Germans and Russians built some of the best tanks, not the French or British.

The Chinese originally invented the rocket, yet they were not the first on the moon.

Photovoltaics was invented by a Frenchman yet the French don't build the best solar cells.

A German built the world's first working programmable, fully automatic computing machine.
The Z3.
But Germans don't build the best computers in the world.


It's a matter of design.
From what we see in Star Trek the Romulans practically build their ships around their cloak while the Klingons build a ship and install a cloaking device.
That's what gives them the edge in that area: design, not who invented the thing.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,764
# 35
04-22-2013, 06:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
You've touched on a point of irritation.

There are Federation players who would rather have KDF exclusives (the exclusives that keep the factions from being homogenous) added to the Federation, rather than PLAY as KDF. For the longest time, Federation players have complained about their cruisers not having dual cannons, and how they don't have built-in cloaks, and about the several useful consoles the KDF has exclusively.

The Federation has already obtained several KDF exclusives as it is. They got access to carriers. They have a cruiser that can cloak, it's just 'not good enough' for them. They have RETAINED their traditional advantages in STO, that being the edge in escorts and their science ship line, and I don't see them in any hurry to give these advantages to the KDF.

Far too many outspoken Fed players seem to be 'take take take', without a care given to retaining differences between factions, and keeping a semblance of balance PvP-wise. We don't like it when Cryptic listens to these greedy players, and then neglects the KDF as they've done in the past.
Very well said.
Richard Hamilton (1975-2014)
goodbye good friend. We will see you in the DMZ in the sky oneday, save a shot for us.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 373
# 36
04-22-2013, 07:06 AM
all I know is that my Romulans will be going to the KDF side of the game.....

but what I see in the future is ALOT of federation Romulans in PVP with the Battlecloak..... does not hurt my feelings as it will then be more like KvK PvP except that the feds are not as skilled in PvP as the KDF......
Major Xi'Zzin
I.R.W. Raptor's Claw
Storm Eagle Class Warbird Fleet Ha'feh
I have never trusted humans, and I never will
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,694
# 37
04-22-2013, 08:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
You've touched on a point of irritation.

There are Federation players who would rather have KDF exclusives (the exclusives that keep the factions from being homogenous) added to the Federation, rather than PLAY as KDF. For the longest time, Federation players have complained about their cruisers not having dual cannons, and how they don't have built-in cloaks, and about the several useful consoles the KDF has exclusively.

The Federation has already obtained several KDF exclusives as it is. They got access to carriers. They have a cruiser that can cloak, it's just 'not good enough' for them. They have RETAINED their traditional advantages in STO, that being the edge in escorts and their science ship line, and I don't see them in any hurry to give these advantages to the KDF.

Far too many outspoken Fed players seem to be 'take take take', without a care given to retaining differences between factions, and keeping a semblance of balance PvP-wise. We don't like it when Cryptic listens to these greedy players, and then neglects the KDF as they've done in the past.
I think most fed players understand the need for faction uniqueness but just don't feel the current implementation is fair at all, and there is something to it.

The Feds have better escorts but the kdf has better cruisers, how much that really matters is debatable but few would compare fed cruisers favorably against KDF battle cruisers.

The console and doff assignments are so blatantly uneven that even the devs have gone on record as it being designed in such a way to encourage players to roll KDF alts. If that wasn't enough I have to ask, other than the escort/cruiser inequalities what does Starfleet have that the KDF does not? Heck, after all the doom and gloom posts and threads by KDF players about the feds getting the leech console while having the MACO shield it turned out that it was the OTHER way around that things happenned! Now the KDF has both the leech and MACO shield! Where was all this talk of faction uniqueness when the MACO shield was transferred over?

Science vessels? The best sci vessels are carriers! Of which only the KDF has had a free T4 version and even with the addition of the Atrox the KDF still possesses the Kar'Fi and frigate carrier pets. Of course that advantage is lessened by the lockbox ships but I think we can all agree to not count those as intrinsic to any faction.

At this point I'm still hoping for something that's really unique for the Federation while worth using. Maybe a console that passively augments a ship's defenses the longer it attacks? That sounds very Fed-ish if power creep-ish.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sorceror01 View Post
....you are a bad starship captain and you should feel bad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tachyonharmonic View Post
However, I think with regard to the Romulan Republic player characters/npcs, it all comes down to a finite point:

These are not the Romulans from the shows.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 622
# 38
04-22-2013, 10:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by skyranger1414 View Post
I think most fed players understand the need for faction uniqueness but just don't feel the current implementation is fair at all, and there is something to it.

The Feds have better escorts but the kdf has better cruisers, how much that really matters is debatable but few would compare fed cruisers favorably against KDF battle cruisers.

The console and doff assignments are so blatantly uneven that even the devs have gone on record as it being designed in such a way to encourage players to roll KDF alts. If that wasn't enough I have to ask, other than the escort/cruiser inequalities what does Starfleet have that the KDF does not? Heck, after all the doom and gloom posts and threads by KDF players about the feds getting the leech console while having the MACO shield it turned out that it was the OTHER way around that things happenned! Now the KDF has both the leech and MACO shield! Where was all this talk of faction uniqueness when the MACO shield was transferred over?

Science vessels? The best sci vessels are carriers! Of which only the KDF has had a free T4 version and even with the addition of the Atrox the KDF still possesses the Kar'Fi and frigate carrier pets. Of course that advantage is lessened by the lockbox ships but I think we can all agree to not count those as intrinsic to any faction.

At this point I'm still hoping for something that's really unique for the Federation while worth using. Maybe a console that passively augments a ship's defenses the longer it attacks? That sounds very Fed-ish if power creep-ish.
I believe you will find we were not begging for the MACO shield. Nor were we begging for your consoles. What you will find is that KDF players have been the voice of faction distinction since the beginning. When the distinction between factions is lost then the choice between factions becomes meaningless.

As for science vessels, if I remember correctly the Vo'Quv has the worst turn rate in the game for any ship. While Feds gripe incessantly regarding the turn rate of their cruisers, the Vo'Quv as a "science vessel" with its horrendous cornering suddenly becomes a boon for the Klingons? Unless someone foolishly wanders into your kill zone, how many times per match does your Commander rank science skill find a target within its firing arc?

Furthermore, name a free dedicated science vessel KDF fields? Now do the same for Feds. You can even expand it to C-Store for both sides and also list the relative shield modifiers for all relevant vessels. Feds clearly have the advantage in the science vocation in addition to tactical escorts.
All cloaks should be canon.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,694
# 39
04-22-2013, 10:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bloctoad View Post
I believe you will find we were not begging for the MACO shield. Nor were we begging for your consoles. What you will find is that KDF players have been the voice of faction distinction since the beginning. When the distinction between factions is lost then the choice between factions becomes meaningless.

As for science vessels, if I remember correctly the Vo'Quv has the worst turn rate in the game for any ship. While Feds gripe incessantly regarding the turn rate of their cruisers, the Vo'Quv as a "science vessel" with its horrendous cornering suddenly becomes a boon for the Klingons? Unless someone foolishly wanders into your kill zone, how many times per match does your Commander rank science skill find a target within its firing arc?

Furthermore, name a free dedicated science vessel KDF fields? Now do the same for Feds. You can even expand it to C-Store for both sides and also list the relative shield modifiers for all relevant vessels. Feds clearly have the advantage in the science vocation in addition to tactical escorts.
I don't think I said anything about it being player's fault. See, why do we end up blaming players when its all on Cryptic?

As far as the Vo'Quv turning like a brick.... well yeah, but the Vo'Quv s more like an artillery piece, it sits far off and launches fighters, sci powers and beams. My first KDF alt (and my only real one as the other KDF alts I have are really just Dil farmers made after the grinds started) was in fact started to fly the Vo'Quv and it did the wholle artillery in space bit amazingly well. With the new rep plasma torps I imagine it must be even better now. And that's just PvE, in PvP the syphon drones were.... controversial already.

All this talk leaves aside the BoP, raiders is a whole class of ship the feds don't have anything similar to. I think this is ok though, without a battlecloak the Aquarius is mostly a vanity ship. And frankly I hate the way the Aquarius looks , so please Cryptic, do NOT make the Aquarius the fed frigate! Give us a gunship beefed up version of the runabout that looks cool.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sorceror01 View Post
....you are a bad starship captain and you should feel bad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tachyonharmonic View Post
However, I think with regard to the Romulan Republic player characters/npcs, it all comes down to a finite point:

These are not the Romulans from the shows.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 373
# 40
04-22-2013, 11:28 AM
ok Im gonna chime in here yet again.....

I have a Primary KDF character (science captain) and I have tried everything to match a fed science captain..... so much so that I made a fed sci captain just to better understand my enemy... in the end I went with the Vo'Quv.... and I do better than most since I do not rely on science powers with a limited arc....

now I have more fed characters than I do KDF but that's fine I still play my KDF more and more in these last months..... using my feds to farm dilithium..... and when the romulans become a faction on the Live server I will find myself fighting for the KDF and looking for a proper fleet.... I have had my Primary KDF Character since the early release and have not really bothered putting as much effort into my fed characters like I did my KDF....

but my observation of this whole argument comes down to cryptic listening to the fed players that yell gimmie gimmie gimmie more than they listen to us KDF players that want to retain the uniqueness that makes the KDF the KLINGON Defense Force
Major Xi'Zzin
I.R.W. Raptor's Claw
Storm Eagle Class Warbird Fleet Ha'feh
I have never trusted humans, and I never will
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