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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 765
# 11
04-23-2013, 05:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by archoncryptic View Post
Without getting into too much detail about the behind the scenes math, you're correct that the RCS changes did not impact Starship Impulse Thrusters skill. That being said, we're evaluating that skill and some other similar modifiers separately, and may be making changes to those as well.
There's still hope that RCS consoles won't suck for slow turning ships then. Thanks for the update.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 801
# 12
04-23-2013, 09:00 PM
You all mean RCS consoles actually have a use... (looks around for that use even behind the sofa and cant find it...)
Monkey see, Monkey do. Monkey flings Feathered Monkey poo...
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,416
# 13
04-23-2013, 09:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sparhawk View Post
There's still hope that RCS consoles won't suck for slow turning ships then. Thanks for the update.
That said, maybe the Galaxy can get a unique ship bonus when equipped with the RCS that increases turn rate? (NOTE: NOT While Saucer Seperated). Fair trade-off given you losing survivability for increased manuverability.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 105
# 14
04-23-2013, 09:30 PM
On my Odyssey, my purple XII RCS is now giving a flat +2.4 bonus to turn rate, instead of +1.2. This makes some sense, as 40 percent of the Odyssey's base turn rate of 6. On Holodeck, My Odyssey was only gaining a +1.2 bonus - which is 40 percent of three, not six.

It does give that same flat bonus regardless of engine power setting and the turn rate bonus from the Odyssey 3-piece set, and I do have nine ranks in Starship Impulse Thrusters.

I can't respec on Tribble to see how thing behave with 0 points in Starship Impulse Thrusters - "There was an error... etc" when I try to accept the changes at the skill trainer.

EDIT: I did more testing just now with my Armitage. My 40 percent RCS console gives a flat rate of +6 under all circumstances, just like my Odyssey.

6 is 40 percent of 15; the Armitage's base turn rate. So, one could say RCS consoles are now doing exactly what the tooltip says - they are giving a bonus of X percent of the ship's BASE turn rate; all other factors ignored. On Holodeck it is currently giving half that.

Last edited by mightionny; 04-23-2013 at 09:50 PM.
Cryptic Studios Team
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 201
# 15
04-24-2013, 10:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lostusthorn View Post
Still makes me wonder, why not toke the change to rework the RCS console into a flat bonus.
Instead giving all ships a % bonus, that again benefits escorts more then cruisers.
We definitely talked about this, but it would have ended up as either a) a nerf for ships that already have a super fast turn rate or b) an extremely high number if we based it on the maximum possible for a super fast ship right now.

While we're always looking at options on this stuff, for the time being we've decided a general boost that benefits everyone (though some proportionately more than others) was a more reasonable approach.

As an added note, I've made a change that will also increase the benefit of Starship Impulse Thrusters skill (in the same way as the RCS consoles were changed). This should be getting to Tribble soon(tm).

Last edited by archoncryptic; 04-24-2013 at 10:52 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,223
# 16
04-24-2013, 10:50 AM
Well, we certainly can't consider anything that nerfs escorts now can we.

Nice to see these being worked on all the same. I suppose.
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Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 17
04-24-2013, 10:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by archoncryptic View Post
We definitely talked about this, but it would have ended up as either a) a nerf for ships that already have a super fast turn rate or b) an extremely high number if we based it on the maximum possible for a super fast ship right now.

While we're always looking at options on this stuff, for the time being we've decided a general boost that benefits everyone (though some proportionately more than others) was a more reasonable approach.
I wouldnt call "rich are getting richer" aproach reasonable, but listening to Geko's podcast I understand that you are just simply afraid to nerf escorts.

On the other hand engineering consoles should be valuable for engineering ships (cruisers) most, not escorts.

The choice in engineering consoles are rather pitiful for a cruiser ?

+5 power ?
+2,5 turn ?
useless crew resistance consoles ?
Armor consoles with diminished returns ?

There is just fundamental flaw in console slots value. Some part of me wishes that tac consoles were so crappy as well.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 18
04-24-2013, 10:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsurutafan01 View Post
Well, we certainly can't consider anything that nerfs escorts now can we.

Nice to see these being worked on all the same. I suppose.

At the same time, the Devs should not cater to the "we hate escorts no matter the change or ramifications" crowd either.

Because as much as I am 100% completely in favor of Cruisers getting a bigger benefit out of RCS consoles then they have had in the past, this is primarily a quality of life issue and not a performance issue.

In PvP, where this game's combat mechanics come to life (seriously, this game has at it's core some exceptionally fun space PvP combat), Escorts live and die by their firing arcs (and their healer support ), where as its mostly a quality of life issue for Cruisers.

Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,223
# 19
04-24-2013, 11:01 AM
I don't hate escorts at all. In fact I play them regularly with my KDF characters.

Mirror Qin Raptor = death death death. It's like art, but with extra doses of death.

My FED character does fly an Odyssey. My ENG consoles have 2 armors, the saucer sep thing, and one turn console. That seems like about as good as you can do there, I guess.

To be honest I'd still rather take a look at cannons draining more power, and beams draining less, and see what can be done with that. I don't particularly have a problem with cruisers turning slowly, although guys like dontdrunkimshoot make good points about turn rate's power in PvP settings.
--------------------------------------

"We are smart." - Grebnedlog

Member of Alliance Central Command/boq botlhra'ghom
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,219
# 20
04-24-2013, 11:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by archoncryptic View Post
We definitely talked about this, but it would have ended up as either a) a nerf for ships that already have a super fast turn rate or b) an extremely high number if we based it on the maximum possible for a super fast ship right now.

While we're always looking at options on this stuff, for the time being we've decided a general boost that benefits everyone (though some proportionately more than others) was a more reasonable approach.

As an added note, I've made a change that will also increase the benefit of Starship Impulse Thrusters skill (in the same way as the RCS consoles were changed). This should be getting to Tribble soon(tm).
???

It SHOULD be a nerf to superfast turning ships. RCS consoles SHOULD be the least useful on a JHAS and most on a cruiser. If you guys have decided to boost everyone more-or-less equally then you've done nothing to close the gap between the least/most maneuverable ships, and just wasted your time except in giving the illusion that you guys are actually fixing stuff.

KBF Lord MalaK
Awoken Dead

You're gonna upgrade my Chel Grett for FREE but charge me $30 to upgrade my Kamarag ?
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