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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 535
# 41
05-13-2013, 05:26 PM
Ugh alright going to go against my own rules here.

Hyouki, you are dead wrong. Yes the powers bring in a new type of gameplay, but the powers are vastly underpowered. With the exception of quantum absorption they're useless in elite, and pretty much useless in standard pve. They're also useless in PVP because any real person can easily get around them.

Now if they were 2-3 times as powerful, then i would be agreeing with you. but they're not.

Power levels mean EVERYTHING. Not having enough power means enemies will rip through your shields, you won't be able to manuver as much. science captains won't have enough power to use their abilities to their maximum level, and you either sacrifice survivability or DPS.

Now this is why i made this topic, to figure out a solution that had nothing to do with the ships or powers themselves but to take the core mechanic and use it to make them even and also lessen the damage on romulans.

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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 151
# 42
05-13-2013, 05:27 PM
Wanted to say sometihng to Hyouki, but cause bascially everything was already said i deleted it again. I took to long to write it.

But i would supportteh idea that we should get Singularity cores taht give us higher basepower instad of the singularity abilities, so everyone is happy.

Ppl like Hyouki can keep their singularity abilities which tehy think are useful, and the otehrs can take the higher powerlvls instead.
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Last edited by captainforfun; 05-13-2013 at 05:31 PM.
Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 317
# 43
05-13-2013, 06:31 PM
they could add a toggle option to enable singularity core overcharging to enable the singularity abilities the effect of it being on would drain -5 from all subsytems while maintaining the cloaks systems would take the other 5
Andy@andy30
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 535
# 44
05-13-2013, 06:53 PM
So now maybe can we get back to the original discussion, changing the actual core item to be more on par with the warp core.

I'd really like some thoughts on my concept which i personally do feel is sound, balanced and should be applied ASAP.

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Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 335
# 45
05-13-2013, 06:54 PM
I agree that the power penalty is just way too huge to be worthwhile for the singularity powers/battle cloak. How about they just nerf the quantum absorption powers and go back to -5 and we call it a day...
Commander
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# 46
05-13-2013, 06:59 PM
would be nice to have them available i mean except for the battery one to be fair.
Andy@andy30
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Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 354
# 47
05-13-2013, 07:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by neok182 View Post
So now maybe can we get back to the original discussion, changing the actual core item to be more on par with the warp core.

I'd really like some thoughts on my concept which i personally do feel is sound, balanced and should be applied ASAP.
The two topics are inextricably linked and can't be discussed independent from one another, as Cryptic/PWE has made it clear the innate -40 power on warbirds is due to singularity powers, the singularity core item is intended to capitalize on the singularity charge mechanic and further offset singularity cores' innate lower power, and warp cores are intended to keep Fed/KDF ships on parity with RRF ships in terms of item count and versatility.

Tweaks to singularity cores, the singularity core items, or warp core items, or their respective mechanics, is going to affect the comparative power of the other(s). This is clear enough in your own posts when you discuss the balance of singularity cores' interaction with singularity charge, compared to warp core default performance.

So, yes, to what you refer as tangential is entirely germane to the conversation.
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Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 354
# 48
05-13-2013, 07:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by neok182 View Post
Yes the powers bring in a new type of gameplay, but the powers are vastly underpowered. With the exception of quantum absorption they're useless in elite, and pretty much useless in standard pve. They're also useless in PVP because any real person can easily get around them.
Funny thing is, compare them side-by-side with their (roughly) analogous science powers, and the singularity powers win out almost every time. Plasma shockwave combines the best aspects of PSW and CPB, and has almost double the AE. QA's one of the best damn heal/mitigation powers in the game. Warp shadow (at least for PvE where aggro matters) knocks the socks off jam and scramble sensors. Singularity jump has a silly number of tactical applications and synergy with mines, PBAoE, and area-denial AE's. Singularity overcharge...yeah. Too much of a buff to singularity powers, without first buffing science powers, would have science captains like me out with the torches and pitchforks howling for blood.
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Career Officer
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# 49
05-13-2013, 08:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by theodrim View Post
The two topics are inextricably linked and can't be discussed independent from one another, as Cryptic/PWE has made it clear the innate -40 power on warbirds is due to singularity powers, the singularity core item is intended to capitalize on the singularity charge mechanic and further offset singularity cores' innate lower power, and warp cores are intended to keep Fed/KDF ships on parity with RRF ships in terms of item count and versatility.

Tweaks to singularity cores, the singularity core items, or warp core items, or their respective mechanics, is going to affect the comparative power of the other(s). This is clear enough in your own posts when you discuss the balance of singularity cores' interaction with singularity charge, compared to warp core default performance.

So, yes, to what you refer as tangential is entirely germane to the conversation.
True, but theres nothing were going to do about the -40 power or the singularity powers. Devs have made that pretty clear. But when you compare the actual core items there is a huge difference between them. Warp gives tons of free power and Singularity pretty much gives nothing unless you have a max charge, but keeping that max charge means not using your singularity abilities, so then whats the point of the abilities if your never going to use them?

Hence why at this point i just tossed out my plan to balance them and not have the core item rely on the charge which means that people just won't use the powers, and make no mistake, that IS whats going to happen.


Quote:
Originally Posted by theodrim View Post
Funny thing is, compare them side-by-side with their (roughly) analogous science powers, and the singularity powers win out almost every time. Plasma shockwave combines the best aspects of PSW and CPB, and has almost double the AE. QA's one of the best damn heal/mitigation powers in the game. Warp shadow (at least for PvE where aggro matters) knocks the socks off jam and scramble sensors. Singularity jump has a silly number of tactical applications and synergy with mines, PBAoE, and area-denial AE's. Singularity overcharge...yeah. Too much of a buff to singularity powers, without first buffing science powers, would have science captains like me out with the torches and pitchforks howling for blood.
True all around, but still very situational and plasma shockwave's damage and dot is terrible. my elite scorpions do more damage than the shockwave, at least from what i can tell.

No doubt that QA is a great power, it's actually the ONLY power i've used in 2 romulan characters up to 35 and i know it'll save my ass in STFS. I don't think it's worth -40 power though.

And same with the rest, don't think any are worth -40, and i don't think they're all worth -40. -20 sure. and maybe -10 to weapons and -10 to aux. but the -40 is just too damn high.

Hence the idea to change the core. flat +10 to one power and +7.5% to another power same as warp cores. That would only bring one system to fed/kdf base, and another system only up about 8 (using 125 weapon to shields on my fed) so you still have -22 power.

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Commander
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Posts: 317
# 50
05-13-2013, 09:03 PM
theodrim if the huge nerfs last year didnt get you howling this isnt gona make a diffrence you should be howling considering the ha'nom is a useles peace of junk its a tactical based sci with 110wep power capable without gutting your science abilities points to get to that power...not to mention it also guts your aux bonus from the ship to 5...yea good luck being able to setup a dps more then around 2.4k with that ship(even though it has cannons O_o)

again they need to make the singularity abilities optional and allows to avoid the power gutting that comes with it

or buff the engineering power+ consoles a bit(or alot)
Andy@andy30
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