Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 470
I just had my first encounter in "Last Stand" with the Elachi Battleship-Control Ship-Support Ship combo. When I saw the battleship I knew it would be a good fight, but it really was an irritatingly long fight.

I thought I saw the key to ending the engagement; take out the control and support ships and leave the battleship exposed. I took out the support ship quickly and was about to take out the control ship when the battleship repaired it to 50% (no problem, I thought), but no sooner than taking it back down again, the same thing happens. I finally just continued to pound the control ship until it was gone.

Now the battleship was exposed and... it was still able to take damage to make the fight too long, and then... its timer for regenerating more control/support ship rang. I finally decided to settle in for a long drawn out fight (took out the support ship and then just focused on the battleship until I wore it down).

The control ship was pumping out tractor beams mines like a machine gun (the first set seemed to drain away my hull strength (but I was able to recover or the system was bugging out and was giving a false reading).

Overall, I think the fight is OK, but the timers on the abilities are too short (especially the jump ability of the battleship which was able to jump almost every time I tried to use eject warp plasma on it). The fight takes forever to complete with the current setup.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 435
# 112
05-19-2013, 03:03 AM
The mentioned Elachi mission(s) are not too difficult for the average player. It just shows that PvE was so easy so far that some never ever learned to play better than that.


This applies to "Last Stand" and "Defense of New Romulus", the latter being much harder.
Both missions are very much doable in a white-geared, one Mk lower than possible stuff equipped D'deridex which isn't a great ship to begin with. Yes, I got killed twice, big deal...?

I actually found Last Stand more difficult as my ship was a total underperformer.


Defense of New Romulus will certainly get toned down. I hope it doesn't become totally nerfed in the process. It is only difficult for players who also find shooting the asteroids in "Night of the Comet" too hard. This means players who don't even try harder but rather cry wolf and nerf nerf here instead of bothering to improve their own ship and their understanding and skill at playing the game.

No worries, it will get nerfed. In the meantime people can work on their BOFF layout, weapon and console setup and maybe this will open them an entirely new dimension of gameplay rather than just putting randomly putting stuff on their ship and believing that it is effective. How about that.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 130
# 113
05-19-2013, 05:04 AM
ok, finally I got to this infamous "Defense of New Romulus", sure I died, seven times I beleve, but difficulty is not an issue here, the AI setup is and I can understand how playing it through could be annoying - being only viable target on map gives you life expectancy of a fish out of water, but seriously, I totally agree with longasc, just use brains instead of whining it's all that is required here, learning the basics of a game also should help
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 550
# 114
05-19-2013, 08:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by longasc View Post
The mentioned Elachi mission(s) are not too difficult for the average player. It just shows that PvE was so easy so far that some never ever learned to play better than that.


This applies to "Last Stand" and "Defense of New Romulus", the latter being much harder.
Both missions are very much doable in a white-geared, one Mk lower than possible stuff equipped D'deridex which isn't a great ship to begin with. Yes, I got killed twice, big deal...?

I actually found Last Stand more difficult as my ship was a total underperformer.


Defense of New Romulus will certainly get toned down. I hope it doesn't become totally nerfed in the process. It is only difficult for players who also find shooting the asteroids in "Night of the Comet" too hard. This means players who don't even try harder but rather cry wolf and nerf nerf here instead of bothering to improve their own ship and their understanding and skill at playing the game.

No worries, it will get nerfed. In the meantime people can work on their BOFF layout, weapon and console setup and maybe this will open them an entirely new dimension of gameplay rather than just putting randomly putting stuff on their ship and believing that it is effective. How about that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by drachenfeles View Post
ok, finally I got to this infamous "Defense of New Romulus", sure I died, seven times I beleve, but difficulty is not an issue here, the AI setup is and I can understand how playing it through could be annoying - being only viable target on map gives you life expectancy of a fish out of water, but seriously, I totally agree with longasc, just use brains instead of whining it's all that is required here, learning the basics of a game also should help
Now look, I find the tone is these two posts a bit down putting.

Sure learning the game/tactics is important, but a good deal of the players in this thread have been here from closed beta or shortly after launch. I think it is safe to say that those of us who have been with the game a long time, knows what works and what does not.

So, the romulan ships might take some getting used to, but they are not that different from the existing ships currently in-game.

Problem is that up until "Defense of New Romulus", the missions are do able, with some being more of a challenge that others. But the final wave in this mission is a leap in difficulty unlike any other mission I have seen in this game, with the exception of "Into the Hive " STF missions, but these are meant to be hard being STF with 5 players.. In "Defense of New Romulus" you are alone in a mission that is toeing the STF teritory in terms of difficulty as it sits now on Tribble.

So this mission needs looking at, but do not get me wrong, I do not want it on a silver platter. This is the last mission in the Vengeance story line, and it should be a bit of a challenge, but not borderline impossible. New players will no doubt feel like it's utterly impossible, since nothing can really prepare you for the leap in difficulty.

Is it the NPC AI?? Possibly, but I also think it's the total number of Elachi ships that is the main problem we are seeing. You have dreadnoughts, battleships, escort ships and fighters.

The dreadnought is as mentiond in this thread bad enough alone, but all the other ships with abilities fiering of like fireworks, means the player is getting mauled.

And the fact that some are finding this mission easy-ish, and some are finding it to be nearly impossible, means that a balance pass is needed. I'm not asking for a nerf, but rather a balance pass being made to the Elachi ships in the final wave.

This mission should as I said above still be a challenge, being the final mission in the Vengeance arc and all, but it should not be almost STF like in difficulty level...

Last edited by otowi; 05-19-2013 at 08:08 AM.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 580
# 115
05-19-2013, 09:11 AM
@longasc, drachenfeles

I entirely concur with Otowi. I'm also kind of offended that the feedback we give it interpreted as whining, rather than us giving our feedback on testing.

You think getting blown up several times in the last leg of a mission offering grueling difficulty in this one spot would have me whine? Think again. If I'd have anything to whine about, it's giving my feedback and not being taken seriously, and being made light of.

What makes your opinion so much better than ours? How about some respect for your fellow posters whom - just like you - enjoy this game and want it to be good; rather than shove them down and deride them to give your opinion more relevancy?

I do think this needs to be fixed, but I don't want it to get too easy either. I think the way to do that is change the non-dying mechanic of the allied ships to the "eternal-1-hit-point" rather than place them in a repair cycle, and have some ships in the Romulan Republic force also be replaced with named unkillable ships such as the R.R.W. Deihu.

The trick here is not to detract from the big space battle and its dangers, so much as preventing the player to be overwhelmed.
Mhae ir-Virinat t'Rillas, R.R.W Temer

Last edited by umaeko; 05-19-2013 at 09:15 AM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 130
# 116
05-19-2013, 09:40 AM
well take a look at the first post in this thread, this is the attitude I call whining

about experience and stuff a year ago I was as clueless as most "rainbow&skittles" builds that fly around, but I did take effort and read about tactics, about mechanics etc. plus I didn't post a single comment about stuff I was green about, not until I got my main character up to 100% STF Elite achievements, because that's basically what separates good player from average, and IMO if someone should be qualified to have opinion about stuff like nerfing is experienced player not a newbie who don't see the whole picture

PS if you took offence in what I said it's entirely you choice

Last edited by drachenfeles; 05-19-2013 at 09:45 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 292
# 117
05-19-2013, 09:55 AM
My assessment of the Defense of New Romuls mission is that it's not working as intended. I'm sure it's quite possible to beat the mission, since some around here have done so. I don't care. It can't be intended that the allies show up and are promptly wiped out so fast that they're completely useless. Oh, yes, there are still technically a few allied ships left, but they're all constantly in repair mode. It can't be intended that I somehow have to take out a control ship that's surrounded by a sea of powerful ships all by myself.

It doesn't matter what my build or fighting tactics are. That's not the issue. The mission is currently broken, and it needs to be fixed.
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 291
# 118
05-19-2013, 10:21 AM
I still firmly belive its a just a number of ships adjustment.

There are not tactics the elachi use that arn't counterable, unlike say, invisible borg death torps, which I havnt seen in awhile, and even the spider tanking can be gotten around.

I really do think this is more about the shear number of ships and how easy it is for them to wipe the npc's and then focus the player. and that adjusting how large the wave is, or even possibly how it comes in, spreading it out a bit more, might solve most of the problems.

A story line mission shouldn't feel like I'm in a elite hive, an this has the ability to quickly slide into that area.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,174
# 119
05-19-2013, 11:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by umaeko View Post
@longasc, drachenfeles

I entirely concur with Otowi. I'm also kind of offended that the feedback we give it interpreted as whining, rather than us giving our feedback on testing.

You think getting blown up several times in the last leg of a mission offering grueling difficulty in this one spot would have me whine? Think again. If I'd have anything to whine about, it's giving my feedback and not being taken seriously, and being made light of.

What makes your opinion so much better than ours? How about some respect for your fellow posters whom - just like you - enjoy this game and want it to be good; rather than shove them down and deride them to give your opinion more relevancy?

I do think this needs to be fixed, but I don't want it to get too easy either. I think the way to do that is change the non-dying mechanic of the allied ships to the "eternal-1-hit-point" rather than place them in a repair cycle, and have some ships in the Romulan Republic force also be replaced with named unkillable ships such as the R.R.W. Deihu.

The trick here is not to detract from the big space battle and its dangers, so much as preventing the player to be overwhelmed.
The purpose of my previous posts was to explain how this mission is beatable. Yes, I think that many of the people who posted about dying repeatedly were doing it wrong. the purpose of my posts was to explain how to do it RIGHT.

But that being said, I do think this mission is a little too hard. Not a LOT just a little.
HAIL HYDRA!

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Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 157
# 120
05-19-2013, 11:39 AM
I get on STO 2 to 4 times a week and the third wave of Elachi in Defense of New Romulus kept me in respawn limbo to the point I considered skipping the mission out of frustration. For the people who got by the mission congrats I salute you but when I did the mission I managed to get 1 command ship down to 88% hull then died the first time and the ship had completely healed by the time I had respawned and as I do not consider myself a casual player (I play too often imho) this portion of the mission is too difficult for casual players. I am not asking for the mission to be handed to us on a dilithium platter but making the flotilla unkillible may be just the thing to balance this mission giving the Elachi more targets than just the player because who wants to get VM'd then hit by 5 cone weapons (what is the name of that weapon) because the VM took your engines off line and to stay alive you had used your engineering team or science team before hand.

Last edited by crappyturbo; 05-19-2013 at 11:42 AM.
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