Lt. Commander
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 205
# 11
06-03-2013, 09:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by scruffyvulcan View Post
I've always thought this made two characters really oddly portrayed.

1. Saavik is half Vulcan, half Romulan. Doesn't that just mean she's Vulcan because she chose that way of life?

2. Sybok. When that bald dude on Nimbus III saw his ears, he was amazed and said, "You're a Vulcan!" Why didn't that guy just assume he was Romulan? And later, when Spock tells them about Sybok, Bones is all, "A passionate Vulcan!" Why didn't someone look at him and say, "You mean, like every Romulan we've ever met?"

1:Kind of like saying someone is half-English

2a: That would complicate the scene
2b: It's been established since the beginning that Vulcans have simmering passions underneath the logical visage. And, everyone probably knew that was just Bones busting Spock's chops yet again.

This is the movie where they traveled to the center of the galaxy so Kirk could say "What does God need with a starship?", and ended with them singing "Row Row Row Your Boat", so, take this movie as you will.

Last edited by javaman1969; 06-03-2013 at 09:21 PM.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 247
# 12
06-03-2013, 09:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gfreeman98 View Post
Sorry, can someone paste a link to this "female Reman"? I don't recall seeing one in the movie. And, wouldn't that make her a Rewoman?
No canon females of the species. I was extrapolating from what the males looked like. I didn't take into account sexual dimorphism.

Though having actually made a reman and seen the facial options, some of them are more hideous then others.
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,076
# 13
06-03-2013, 09:54 PM
I'm not really that fond of the job Cryptic did on making he Remans, but when i first started coming across the Female Remans it just seemed like even less effort had been put into it.

As a whole, over the course of the 2000 evolutionary difference it is safe to assume that Romulans no longer have the Vulcan strength or secondary eyelid due to the less hellish environment which is why it never came up in canon until the 2009 movie. Similarly it's why the Remans have much larger heads as well as greater telepathic abilities as well was possibly physically stronger which is why they were perfect shock troopers during the dominion war. While it might be possible that they can still interbreed it is highly unlikely due to cultural prejudices of Romulans against the physical appearance of the Remans. As shown in canon, since most of the species are in fact based on the common ancestor of the preservers, cross breeding is a fairly common thing so breeding between remans and romulans should in fact be easier than between vulcans and humans or humans and romulans.
Career Officer
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 4,409
# 14
06-03-2013, 11:11 PM
if star trek showed anything is that the majority of the species in the alpha quadrant and perhaps some in gamma and beta quadrant all have a similar genetic history with each other, it was used to unlock a genetic puzzle to find the preservers. so its possible that a number of species are more compatible then others, however they are still compatible no matter how distant.

i also discount the theory that remans are vulcans who refused to give up their telepathic powers as evolution takes millions of years, not thousands.

its also not possible for romulans in a short time unless assisted by outside help as they may have interbred with another race to lose the internal emotional suppression system, the ability to eat more then veg and give them a hard v ridge on their foreheads. in order for the vulcans to reach the point they could build ships and march under the raptors wings, they must has been around for more then 50,000 years if not more due to their violent nature before Surak and in order for them to be what they are they didnt evolve the same as us, they just changed their perception after the nuclear disaster on vulcan. so if anything they should be a bit like the romulans from TOS, no v ridge, and more emotionally stable thinking things a bit more logically.

Remans are tied to the romulan people since the vulcans found the planet to call home, it may have been the intent of these vulcans to live peacefully with the remans and perhaps asked a bit too much of the remans when they could of setup an agreement that remans worked and they are supported by the new government.. but the vulcans may have seen it as illogical after a short time and the remans grew fed up with this logic business. i dunno where it would of gone wrong, but remans ended up a slave race in the dilithium mines on remus and fueling the romulan warmachine. i would say that cosmic may have a point.

as for STO remans though, the remans in game look nothing like nemesis remans at all. so female or not, it doesnt change anything beyond the fact that remans in game are not represented properly.
Joined STO late 2010. Bought starter pack LoR & LTS 2013.
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Last edited by mirrorchaos; 06-03-2013 at 11:15 PM.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,150
# 15
06-04-2013, 02:59 AM
My take on this matter: Both Romulans and Remans are not only the descendants of the Vulcans who left their home planet after the Sundering, but also mixed themselves with a species that was native to Romulus or Remus. That is why Romulans occasionally have forehead ridges, while Vulcans don't, and why Remans look so vastly different: Their share of "native blood" is higher than with the Romulans. This also stays in line with all canon sources, just invents a bit on top of that.
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,374
# 16
06-04-2013, 03:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gfreeman98 View Post
Sorry, can someone paste a link to this "female Reman"? I don't recall seeing one in the movie. And, wouldn't that make her a Rewoman?
She's in the game in the romulan storyline
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,076
# 17
06-04-2013, 03:20 AM
The thing to remember here though is that Vulcans were already a lot more advanced both Physically and technologically than humans were at the time of the sundering. Two things that play a huge part in development of a people is Environment and Technology, something that even humans today are being changed by over the course of decades rather than thousands of years, although just look at how much humans have changed over the last few thousand years as well. If it's possible in real life, then in a universe like star trek, it's more than possible that a few thousand years could mean the difference between Vulcans, romulans, and remans when in extremely different environments, especially given that they're already more evolutionarily advanced and possibly more adaptable to change over fewer generations.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,388
# 18
06-04-2013, 03:41 AM
My thoughts on the subject are as follows:

The proto-Vulcans in TNG had the same forehead configuration as TNG Romulans. Not many Romulans were seen in ToS, so my theory, is that the forehead isactually a historically Vulcan trait, which was 'bred out' following the Separation, possibly simply due to the difference in political affiliation following genetic lines as has been seen historically many times... Over time, most Romulans typically retain the proto-Vulcan forehead, with a minority (possibly of 'sympathizer descent' rather than the traditional bloodline distinction'), having what is considered a 'more Vulcan' appearance, and Vulcans obviously appearing as they do...

With regards the Remans, I don't believe they are in any way evolved/mutated from
Romulans, but simply the indigenous people to Remus who were subjugated by the incoming Romulans (the Son'a integrated two additional race into their culture as a labor class) who enslaved them to mine dilithium. I find that more plausible, than the idea of Romulan geneticists taking the trouble to bio-engineer an off-shoot species simply to use them as slave-labor for such manual work and as canon-fodder.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 604
# 19
06-04-2013, 01:28 PM
I prefer not to consider Remans at all. Worst retcon race ever made.
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Survivor of Remus
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 177
# 20
06-05-2013, 06:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by scruffyvulcan View Post
I've always thought this made two characters really oddly portrayed.

1. Saavik is half Vulcan, half Romulan. Doesn't that just mean she's Vulcan because she chose that way of life?

2. Sybok. When that bald dude on Nimbus III saw his ears, he was amazed and said, "You're a Vulcan!" Why didn't that guy just assume he was Romulan? And later, when Spock tells them about Sybok, Bones is all, "A passionate Vulcan!" Why didn't someone look at him and say, "You mean, like every Romulan we've ever met?"
Think of the difference between Vulcan and Romulan as religious rather then biological and it all makes sense.
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