Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,122
# 41
06-14-2013, 05:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sophlogimo View Post
Ah, so we are talking about Cruiser/escort hybrids here, a few very special cases like the Fleet Torkaht, the Regent or the Tactical BortasQ'. But the abovementioned generalizations are rather not helpful here, when the question is as the subject sais.

In essence: No, you don't have to take an escort, you can always use a cruiser that is almost like an escort.
No, its not that special, any cruiser with lt cmd tac. The oddy, excel, assault refit, and then lock box cruisers like the d'kora, galor, etc. They play like a cruiser, not an escort.

It is all about time on target. An escort only seems op when its weapons are right on target, when its not.. its doing nothing. A cruiser's beams are hitting constantly, and keeping a broadside on targets isn't that difficult.
My tac escort will often score about 12-13k dps average in an STF. It can do burst damage around 55k. Some STFs like CSE is much higher.
My eng cruiser is generally 9-10k, with bursts up to 30k.

Considering the damage boosts a tac gets, that eng cruiser does pretty well. In STFs like ISE its pretty typical for the cruiser to score over 10, while the escort gets less because it has to hunt for spheres, generators and transformers which are all placed poorly for cannon fire.
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,940
# 42
06-14-2013, 05:21 AM
as it goes for leveling: sure an escort or tac will mean you level faster...take any random MMO/RPG you know, and try to level a tank or healer class solo...then take the same game and level a DD class...

if you don't have the time, the answer is simple: you level fastest with a dd class, period.

STO even makes it easier for any class to level by making the ship optional. Any class is more than viable in escorts for leveling. DPS is king, thats not only true for sto. What is true for sto however is the endgame content design that is definately not the brightest aspect of the game.

3 years and the game went from 4 stfs back to 3 and then again up to 4...
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Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,997
# 43
06-14-2013, 05:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtshead View Post
[...]
Also, your rule could just as easily be stated as: "If you want to do a large amount of damage, you should choose a ship designed for that role", which I would argue is both intuitive and non-controversial.
[...]
I would have thought that, too.

Now, the question raised in this topic could be read as: "Should you always choose a ship designed for DPS?"
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Promote what you love, instead of bashing what you hate.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 187
# 44
06-14-2013, 05:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sophlogimo View Post
Could someone please enlighten me how a ship with 2 tactical consoles, using single beams, can possibly do more damage than an escort with 5 tactical consoles, using Dual Heavy Cannons and turrets?

Because, uhm, it is quite unintuitive that the ship with less mathematical damage potential should do more damage. Or should I say, complete nonsense?
You sir are both naive and close minded, however, you are in good company with most of the other people who post on this forum. Allow me to enlighten you.

Here is my Fleet Tor'Kaht build: http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=notanescort_0

hmmm... not quite DBBs and 2 tac consoles huh? The thing about the Tor'Kaht/Vor'cha is its maneuverable enough to use those DHCs that you are SOOO quick to claim cruisers cant use, but it has 1.5x the hull of your escort.

Remember everyone, KDF has cruisers too...
Light Speed! - No, light speed is too slow. We need LUDICROUS SPEED!

Ajma420 - Lv 50 Tac - Pride of the Federation
Catherine The Great - Lv 50 Tac - Pride of the Empire
Vladimir - Lv 50 Tac - Pride of the Rihannsu Empire
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 91
# 45
06-14-2013, 06:02 AM
Well I feel offended You Escort Captains frankly NEED us to Tank so you can pew-pew :p

My two main characters (my Fed and my Rom) have very different play styles. My Feddy flies around in what I, aptly, call the USS Glass Cannon as thats precisely what my Kumari is and should be used for. My Rom was previously in the D'deridex-R but now (thank you lower exchange prices) Captains a Tal Shiar Battle Cruiser. Guess which ones my favourite.

If anything, I've found its Science Vessels that need a little buffage. I'd rather fly my all beam boat then my top heavy glass cannon IMO







P.S. I'm not trying to start an argument or anything, just my humble opinion as someone whose been here since beta
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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 187
# 46
06-14-2013, 06:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wanderer89 View Post
Well I feel offended You Escort Captains frankly NEED us to Tank so you can pew-pew :p

My two main characters (my Fed and my Rom) have very different play styles. My Feddy flies around in what I, aptly, call the USS Glass Cannon as thats precisely what my Kumari is and should be used for. My Rom was previously in the D'deridex-R but now (thank you lower exchange prices) Captains a Tal Shiar Battle Cruiser. Guess which ones my favourite.

If anything, I've found its Science Vessels that need a little buffage. I'd rather fly my all beam boat then my top heavy glass cannon IMO
Finally someone who gets it. I applaud your judgement.
Light Speed! - No, light speed is too slow. We need LUDICROUS SPEED!

Ajma420 - Lv 50 Tac - Pride of the Federation
Catherine The Great - Lv 50 Tac - Pride of the Empire
Vladimir - Lv 50 Tac - Pride of the Rihannsu Empire
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 387
# 47
06-14-2013, 07:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sophlogimo View Post
Now, the question raised in this topic could be read as: "Should you always choose a ship designed for DPS?"
Almost the right question. The trouble is that too many people unthinkingly answer "yes" to this question because they believe and/or assume and/or read on the interwebz that DPS is the only thing that matters if you want to have fun in the game.

So, really, the question here is "Can I have fun playing something other than a DPS ship?", and the answer to that question really depends on personality. Certainly some people enjoy a more deliberate pace through missions, while others feel like doing anything other than blowing things up fast is a chore. Some people focus on solo play, while others love being a team supporter. Some want combat to be fast and sharp, while others like a more grinding battle of attrition. None of these approaches is objectively right or wrong, but the only way to know which works for a given player is to try them both and see which one feels better.

In any case, the trouble starts when one of two things happen - players who were having fun doing "Y" are told by an internet talking head that they are having "wrongbadfun" because they aren't doing "X", or players who want to play an "X" focused playstyle want to use a ship/class that is designed to do "Y".
Lieutenant
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 58
# 48
06-14-2013, 09:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adrianm63 View Post
so you dont fly a escort because you want your cruiser to be a escort .They should release cruiser holoemitters because clearly the problem is the way the ship looks.

Cruisers are the tanky ships not the dps ships.If you want dps fly escort but dont QQ about how hard is to get dps from a cruiser.
There is a Cruiser Escort ship which is called the chimera.
It has a turn rate better than science vessels and durability close to a cruiser
its not as good in a 100% role as either the cruiser or escort, but it does pack a punch. I liken it to pocket battleships in WW2.
It also makes a terrific tour guide, has a 60s Slipstream, and its size, makes it less likely to miss the centre of Gamma Orionis...

Last edited by eugenesys; 06-14-2013 at 09:16 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 569
# 49
06-14-2013, 09:47 AM
another one of these threads huh?

Hey all of you escort captains. How all of us 3+ year veterans get into some cruisers and show these guys how it is done? By the time we are finished, they'll never gripe about escorts again and they'll be asking for cruiser nerfs LOL

I am serious about this. Tired of these cruiser whimps crying foul against escorts alll of the time because they don't want to spend some brain power and learn the nuances of the game like the rest of us did.
Member since January 2010. I AM NOT A PWE FAN!!!!
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 959
# 50
06-14-2013, 11:04 AM
It's going to be a good ISE run: 5 Escorts
It's going to be a bad ISE run: 5 (Fed)cruisers

It's going to be a good PvP match: 2 Escorts and 3 (decent) science ships
It's going to be a (very) bad PvP match: 5 cruisers
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