Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 373
# 81
07-18-2013, 07:50 AM
I like dropping these mines out when Im using my Cloaked Barrage

because there is that moment when you are taking a fully buffed alpha strike while Im still cloaked that I pop the mines out hit evasive and GTFO...
Major Xi'Zzin
I.R.W. Raptor's Claw
Storm Eagle Class Warbird Fleet Ha'feh
I have never trusted humans, and I never will
Captain
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 604
# 82
07-18-2013, 07:58 AM
Are 'gay mines' the ones that just limply go 'poof' when they hit? :p
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,332
# 83
07-18-2013, 08:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iskandus View Post
This is only possible because you ran into a lame team. Any team that is half decent would immediately swarm you and take you out, especially they can talk in team chat and virtually all will immediately target the spawn camper. If multiple targets had to respawn, then the web mines can't get them all. T'ommo once did web mines spawn camping in Kerrat, it can't kill everyone because the max. number of mines is 10. Furthermore, which team will be lame enough for you to take out their spawn point defenses & turrets deserve to lose. I can't recall seeing spawn camper in C&H for as long as I can remember. In Kerrat, times to times, C&H, never. Sometimes, a team will be so bad that they have been pushed back all the way to their spawn point and their defenses destroyed but no one will sit there to mine. Further to that, spawn point mechanism has been changed such that not all ships respawn near each other.

In other words, what you said can only be a greatly exaggerated threat. Spawn camping using web mines have not been terribly effective due to their number limitation at 10 mines. In addition, people can respawn much faster than you can lay those mines every 30 sec on a Scim. Clearly, your claim was greatly exaggerated mixed with some false info in it. Mixing half truth with half lies is not smart, because you will get caught one way orh the other. You are also being a hypocrite because it's hard to find anyone crying as loudly as you have been about these mines yet you carry them on top of dispersal patterns.

Meanwhile, I have just started a new build based on Klingon inspired cheats...uh, I mean "tactics". See this: Sci captain who can reach sustainable & constant 17.5K in dps for the duration of an APO3 / ambush alpha, not including expected initial burst damage of 35K of energy damage + up to 93K of kinetic damage within the first 5 seconds. Not going to tell what went into it or how, suffice to say the above number does not use either the Nukara Mines or the Cluster Torp. Don't get me wrong, they are still there - in the rear. In case, the frontal assault did not kill the target(s), the mines will then be drop and the cluster fired. You are reading these sustainable dps numbers and burst damages correctly - a Sci captain who is not only capable of ultra high dps - few escorts can break the 10K barrier, let alone going above 15K - it's a also a ship specialized in disable with all the nasty features like Viral Matrix, Subnuke, Tractor Beams, Warp Plasma. Gotta thank those Klingons in Kerrat for being such great tutors, now all the Klingons who pvp will benefit from these nasty tools...

Seeing how many crying Klingons cursing about my all-projectile build, I decided to do something drastically different. Heck, I was accused of using "gay mines" whatever that was supposed to mean. The mines had no dispersal pattern and there was only 2 of them. If someone managed to get killed by that, they suck. In reality, the said ship is already at 50% hull when trapped, so of course he died. But he has the audacity to blame it on 2 little mines calling them "gay" is just insulting.

Anyone who tries to run a DBP3 build with these mines will quickly notice what a big waste this tactic is. Even some of the best cloaked mine layers in Kerrat have very low hit rate with these mines. People adapt quickly. If you want to use these mines, don't use dispersal pattern unless you really want to waste a boff station for nothing.
Little misunderstanding there, iskandus? He just said that he would spawncamp in response to enemies using the mines - not that he was using the mines to spawncamp.

Also, kinda weird to be talking about your latest, so DPSy new sci build here, eh? Or is it simply to brag? Very proud of that Fleet Norgh, eh?

Still, I think everyone needs to take a raincheck. I think that Cryptic has proven a number of times that they don't care too much about powercreep and general balance unless it isn't WAI, affects PvE or utterly knocks balance for a loop. At least, not enough to take quick action.

So, if we want to prove that something is OP, we need to use and abuse it. Not much point complaining in the forums, since it's so slow to create change. Instead, spam it so that anyone who gets hit cries like crazy, and when they complain, just tell them exactly why we use it. Protest by using it. Spread the qq to so many parts of the community that we can actually motivate corrective action. And if it turns out to not be so OP in the process, well, no problem, eh? It's a legit tactic, so no problem spamming!
Take it easy!

Ishmael@scurry5: A Nibbling Sci
"Squeak?"

Last edited by scurry5; 07-18-2013 at 08:15 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,134
# 84
07-18-2013, 08:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iskandus View Post
In other words, what you said can only be a greatly exaggerated threat. Spawn camping using web mines have not been terribly effective due to their number limitation at 10 mines. In addition, people can respawn much faster than you can lay those mines every 30 sec on a Scim. Clearly, your claim was greatly exaggerated mixed with some false info in it. Mixing half truth with half lies is not smart, because you will get caught one way orh the other. You are also being a hypocrite because it's hard to find anyone crying as loudly as you have been about these mines yet you carry them on top of dispersal patterns.

.
Was just using energy weapons and racked up over 40 kills and 2 mil damage that match without using any web mines just energy which unlike your OP mines have many counters to them.
Tala -KDF Tac- House of Beautiful Orions
Ensign
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 9
# 85 Avid User of Nukara Web Mines
07-18-2013, 08:37 AM
Hi all. This is my perspective on the web mines. I pretty much live in Ker'rat and do many 5 v 5 and cap and hold. Before these came out I built a mine/transphasic build with 5 movement debuffs, and I wanted the mines as an additional movement debuff. As soon as i got them I took a fleet mate into a 1 v 1 to test them. With a DPB3 no buffs I nearly dropped a gem dread 1 shot, both me and him both said Ho Lee Sheet! Then I fully buffed and dropped them and before half the damage was done he was dead. But along with this kind of destructive power I do find them balanced in most situations. The only time I think they are abused, which I do often, is to mine a spawn point.

Here are some interesting facts about them, Some mentioned before, some not mentioned.

#1 Mine damage consoles do not affect these at all. Rule 62 and all other damage modifier consoles do not affect the mines. The only thing that affects the damage is tac team tac fleet alpha omega and gama.

#2 The long charge time makes them easy to avoid. it is also important to note they cant be shot down until they ARE active. Once they "blink" on they are destructable.

#3 Unlike other mines they are NOT AOE damage. a mine dispersal can hit multiple targets with multiple mines, but each mine itself only affects a single target, no AOE dispersion.

#4 People adapt: Very quickly people realize not to chase someone deploying these mines. i can usually catch a person once or twice and lure them into an armed web minefield, but after 1 or two times they learn not to chase me directly or watch their minimap.

#5 People Adapt more: Since I started my mine ship a month or two ago, the setups of most ships in Ker'rat and in pvp's have changed. More pets on intercept, more aceton assimilators, and more beam spam. Repulsor beams were also unseen until recently. I never even saw transphasic boats until I designed mine and made it effective.

#6 The damage from web mines is NOT credited to the owner. Using them in Ker'rat for example when farming is counter productive. The items desgnated to you after an NPC is killed is based on the damage YOU do. If the web mines hit that target it will lessen the ammount and quality of the drops, and even eliminate ANY drops if they did too much damage. The damage is credited to "unknown entity". 3 ways I know this. I killed 5 tac cubes in a row with web mines doing most of the damage solo, and not a single drop. A player killed in a 5v5 que will not show the name of the killer when killed by web mines. I took my other char into a 1 v 1 and did damage with only web mines, the damage table still said I had done 0 damage.

I currently have 2 ships that use the web mines and transphasic builds with 2 different tactics. One is a slower gem heavy escort carrier with tractors and eject plasma and such to slow down a target for the mines to be able to hit the target. The second is a corvette with only a tractor and raw speed to dive bomb enemies and place mines directly on a target and get out of harms way fast.

With the experience of both I have noticed the web mines are most effective on very slow cruisers, dreads and carriers. Those are slow enough to hit the targets you intend rather than randomly hitting other targets. In 5 v 5 matches the web mines normally are shot down or hit pets or other targets rather than people. if they do hit a person even with disperal 3 only a few mines hit a person, and if noticed by players they will target the person who is stunned by the mines.
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 361
# 86
07-18-2013, 08:58 AM
i cant believe im Reading this ... people actually think the mines are fine and completelly normal ?
it's not the ship or the build, it's the atitude
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,210
# 87
07-18-2013, 09:00 AM
I'll be getting them when hit Nukara T4. Will be putting them on my Vesta, with my sci, to compensate for the fact that GWIII is useless now.

STAR TREK BATTLES - HIGH DPS PLAYERS NEED NOT APPY
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 361
# 88
07-18-2013, 09:09 AM
intead of boosting it, boosting ? nah, let's launch more broken stuff, of course we wont boost psw and tachyon beam !
it's not the ship or the build, it's the atitude
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,134
# 89
07-18-2013, 09:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by destikhar View Post
Hi all. This is my perspective on the web mines. I pretty much live in Ker'rat and do many 5 v 5 and cap and hold. Before these came out I built a mine/transphasic build with 5 movement debuffs, and I wanted the mines as an additional movement debuff. As soon as i got them I took a fleet mate into a 1 v 1 to test them. With a DPB3 no buffs I nearly dropped a gem dread 1 shot, both me and him both said Ho Lee Sheet! Then I fully buffed and dropped them and before half the damage was done he was dead. But along with this kind of destructive power I do find them balanced in most situations. The only time I think they are abused, which I do often, is to mine a spawn point.

.
So even though you can easily kill a Jem dread before even half the damage is done its still balanced, how?

I also have died to mines on the spawn from this, which I'm sure must have been you, I'll be watching the spawn more with my B'rel when you are around and dropping an AA just before reset or using GW or AMS.
Tala -KDF Tac- House of Beautiful Orions
Captain
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,003
# 90
07-18-2013, 10:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by destikhar View Post
But along with this kind of destructive power I do find them balanced in most situations. The only time I think they are abused, which I do often, is to mine a spawn point.
Ah, I think I know you. "Destikhar", sounds very familiar in Kerrat. If I remember, there is usually 2 of you. Haven't seen you guys for quite some time. Love it how you two attract so much agro from the Klinks there.
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