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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 414
Seriously, they seem to be doing much more damage now.

Just a bit of a reference.

5 months or so ago, I had posted a thread asking to help me win a bet for help on beating my friend's tac in a fleet patrol escort with my engineer in an Excelsior.

After a long and hard fought battle to try and make the engineer do some damage, I had given up.

We ultimately just crunched numbers, and with me sitting 4k away broadsiding, with neither of us moving, it was clear I could do no damage to him. His shields would flicker a bit, but never take any real damage, and his hull regen was enough to compensate any bleed through (tested this again on tribble when leadership was nerfed, with the same result).

So yes, I had given up on the engineer and began again with a tac. Same ship same build.

For number crunching sake, we decided to run the same test, but begin with my engineer again for a benchmark.

Only this time, I completely decimated his shields. I mean they just melted away. I had brought her out of retirement just for this test so I had no Nukara rep and had a standard issue warp core.

After a fairly lengthy dual (15 minutes or so) I still couldn't kill him, but I did get him down to the single digits on his hull several times. If I were to now grind Nukara rep and get some better gear I think I could win easily.

The thing is, he has been steadily improving his ship. Warp core, the Nukara rep, going from Mk xi's to Mk xii's, etc.

So I ask, what has happened? I mean it was the same ship and build, no changes. I find it hard to believe that EPtW1's 10% damage increase made THAT much of a difference.

Did I miss a patch or something?
Career Officer
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 522
# 2
07-02-2013, 03:37 AM
FAW boost?
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 414
# 3
07-02-2013, 03:40 AM
Originally Posted by magniacapra View Post
FAW boost?
in the initial test (the just sit there and broadside, not an actual fight) I didn't use FAW. In fact, I think I had a BO2 slotted for running DBBs. I didn't use it though. Just basic numbers crunching. When we actually did fight, I switched out to FAW.

But to answer your question, no FAW wasn't a factor.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 386
# 4
07-02-2013, 04:13 AM
You might have the same build but you now have different/more traits. Your engi probably did pick the engi trait that gives him 10 power when using eptx. That lasts 15sec with 3 points in batteries. So with two eptx cycling you will always have a power boost.
The eptw buff affects your real dmg, not your base dmg I think. So it is a real 10% increase, thats actually quite a bit.

Also did you have traits like accurate 5 months ago? I think now every race can pick it, it was quite limited before.

Also there is your opponent. Maybe he respecced some rep passives, got placate instead of heal for example. Or he changed his shield. Maybe he had specific resists against your dmg type in the past? Maybe he generally sacrificed defense to get more offense?

What would of course help is if you had a parse from 5 months ago an a parse from your recent fight. Of course there might also have been a change in beams that I am unaware of.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 139
# 5
07-02-2013, 04:31 AM
Beams are currently benefitting from being overcapped in weapon power. Past 125, they continue to stack at 2% extra damage per point. Past 125, EPS consoles also have been found to affect power return to weapon power (which it doesn't do below 125).

As such, PvEers have been pushing beam builds to 20k+ dps, well past what cannon builds can touch. This is primarily why we are seeing more "meatgrinder" builds in PvP, as many have figured this out.

It isn't a FAW issue, it's a beam issue.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,525
# 6
07-02-2013, 04:36 AM
Uh, how is it an "issue"?
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Republic Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 367
# 7
07-02-2013, 04:42 AM
This is good, spread the info and stop those cannos op threads
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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 139
# 8
07-02-2013, 04:48 AM
Well, most long time players remember when PvP was all beams, all FAW meat grinder. While it isn't overrunning PvP right now, there are a few premade groups who have already started doing it to great success.

Stack 5 ships with full beams, FAW, 2-3 EPS consoles, and overcap using EPtW, A2B, leech, batteries, etc... it is near impossible to deal with unless your team has 4 healers.

If cannons could overcap, there would be outrage.
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Lag Industries STO/TOR Guild
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 414
# 9
07-02-2013, 05:00 AM
Very interesting.

I had noticed that sitting at 120ish weapon power before EPtW1, my power hardly drained at all. We're talking mid to high 90's with 7 beams.

We were kinda burned out after the test and didn't get to testing my tac though so I can't give you a difference between the two.

As far as the traits though, I don't see that being a factor so much in the difference between the two tests, considering it was just a numbers test which involved park and broadside.

Unless of course you take into consideration the extra bonus from EPtX going into weapon power, thus pushing it over cap, as mentioned.

Tacs will still do more damage of course, but perhaps this overcap + engineer traits and maybe finding a way to put EPtW3 on my ship, and maybe, just maybe engineers can be somewhat viable?

I suppose it doesn't really matter to me anymore since my tac is now right at the same level my engineer was when I retired him, hehe. Would still be awesome though if engineers weren't such a joke anymore.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 596
# 10
07-02-2013, 06:02 AM
Slowly people start to wake their eyes up, beams were never buffed, other than faw was being fixed, beam overload is still bugged and doesn't benefit from your accuracy

There is cap in the bonus dmg beams get tho, and it's fully based on the drain, not on the power system values, ignore the up and down power movement since it has nothing to do with it, beams are simply draining from the maxium weapon power, meaning that firing 1 beam with OVER 9000!!! weapon power is not gonna do anything, its fully related to the draining of the beams.

Record dps numbers in PvE content I have heard of, are 28.8k with beams, full ****** tac bortasque beam boat and 25.6k with 5 DHC full ****** dps kumari build with 0 heals.

I'm sure these numbers will get higher once certain people jump to their scimitars... race between beams and dhc has began.
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