Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 203
# 91
07-04-2013, 07:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by devian666 View Post
You talking about not being greedy, paying your fair share, working together and being socially responsible. This is an alien language to most of the US players. They aren't just blinded by ideology but masses of corporate funded propaganda. Even though what you have said is completely reasonable some will view this as a communist plot.

A lot of fleets would have more progress if they worked together as suggested instead of the "**** you got mine" attitude. On the flip side there are players that are burnt out trying to contribute to these projects. If everyone in the fleet has the attitude that they want to contribute something, even minor, it makes short work of the projects.
That was exactly what I was talking about but it seems those things are out of style now and sociably unacceptable in modern US society, outdated concepts. And yes I have already been called a pinko, a commie, and other less endearing monikers.

Its sad to say but you're right, its all about what can I get and what can you/they/we do for me now. There are still quite a few of us over here that believe in the things you said above but we are slowly becoming less and less and tend to get shouted down or attacked by those who believe in the all for me attitude.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 527
# 92
07-04-2013, 08:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by leod198 View Post
We do not need new taxes. What we need is better logs. Join date, purchase log, detail contribution log. That way we can reward your best fleet members and kick out leachers.
Yes , better logs is what i want.
Bone1970 & Bone trader don't believe in a no-win senario, Kirk's protege. Fed Tac's. BNE Fed Sci.
Bag of Bones & Bone Ugly don't believe in a no-win senario, Kirk's protege. Rom/Fed Tac. Bone & Bone2 don't believe in a no-win senario, Kirk's protege. KDF Eng's.
Warning: Not a native English-speaker, sorry if my English sucks.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,460
# 93
07-04-2013, 08:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by magnumstar View Post
I like your idea better too. I just wish I would have heard it sooner so I could have posted it instead of mine but then the read would have not been near as interesting.
Well think about it like this:

If you hadn't posted your idea, I would've probably not come up with mine.

So there's something positive at least.

Lieutenant
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 32
# 94
07-04-2013, 09:00 PM
worst idea ever
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 380
# 95
07-04-2013, 11:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by magnumstar View Post
Taxes also insure that no single person is paying for the streets we use, the bridges we drive over, the schools are kids attend, and other services we all here in America enjoy.
That is the definition of socialism; everybody "paying their fair share" is socialism (not communism, but close). You seem to be terribly confused about what you want: you insist that people should only receive what they earn, and no-one should have to pay for anyone else, and yet in the same sentence advocate union fees i.e. everyone paying for everyone else?

In the free market one who has a product can set the price and rules regarding it's purchase. The fleets are run as a laissez-faire free market; if you do not want someone to have what you are offering (for any reason, be it financial or ideological) you are free to turn them away, that is to remove them from the fleet.

Either you advocate the free market, and no union dues; or you advocate socialism and a tax on fleet membership. There is no middle ground. You cannot have your cake and eat it.

Last edited by edwardianed; 07-05-2013 at 03:09 AM.
Captain
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,482
# 96
07-05-2013, 05:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by magnumstar View Post
Not taxes but union dues. I don't think its unfair to charge a fee everyone will be paying so everyone contributes. I also don't care for the welfare state you are promoting and would be glad to put my foot in anyones behind that does. I'm not the fleet leader but if I was and kicked everyone who wasn't contributing then there wouldn't be much of a fleet left. There are too many out there who would rather enjoy the free ride than pay their way, but you better believe they will accept the benefits they haven't earned.

I'm an old biker dude that's worked for everything I have and I absolutely hate a free loader.

So, as stated, mandate them to contribute or kick them. However, that is what YOU want in YOUR fleet.... there should be absolutely no reason for YOUR idea of how YOUR fleet should work to be mandated EVERYWHERE on EVERYBODY. There is nothing stopping your fleet from kicking non-contributing players.
LtGen. Mara Navar, IKS Rozhenko, Mogh Battle-Cruiser (Orion, KDF Tactical Officer)
VADM T'Prel Movar, RRW Imperator Scimitar Warbird (Fed-Romulan Tactical Officer) - Commissar - Fleet Executive Officer Armageddon Steel Legion
VADM Genestra, USS Audacious, Venture-X Dreadnaught (Betazoid, Fed Engineering Officer)
VADM Lenara Jomm, USS Heraclitus, Vesta Class (Joined Trill, Fed Science Officer)
Captain
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,482
# 97
07-05-2013, 05:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by magnumstar View Post
Aren't part of the projects we contribute to are in fact building parts of the base? So I contribute and build it while others sit on their thumbs. If they pay their dues all stores are open to them, what's wrong with that? Its not like 1000 Dil a day is a lot, one estf and you damn near have it. 1000ecs, I can get that replicating junk from my inventory. This way everyone is free to play without having to grind for anything.
Since you are the "ruggest biker indivudualist" rather than propose to force some union dues systems on all fleets because yours doesn't do things you would want them to do... why don't you just leave your fleet, find at least 4 other people who think like you, and then start your own fleet.
LtGen. Mara Navar, IKS Rozhenko, Mogh Battle-Cruiser (Orion, KDF Tactical Officer)
VADM T'Prel Movar, RRW Imperator Scimitar Warbird (Fed-Romulan Tactical Officer) - Commissar - Fleet Executive Officer Armageddon Steel Legion
VADM Genestra, USS Audacious, Venture-X Dreadnaught (Betazoid, Fed Engineering Officer)
VADM Lenara Jomm, USS Heraclitus, Vesta Class (Joined Trill, Fed Science Officer)
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