Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 398
# 111
07-29-2013, 10:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonsills View Post
Some of y'all really need to go read about what Roddenberry thought of every Trek movie after The Motionless Picture. Or how many of the things we disliked about the first two seasons of TNG were also Roddenberry's babies (like, for instance, Wesley Crusher, a Mary Sue for Eugene Wesley Roddenberry).

What TOS was, and what TNG and DS9 became, were almost as much in spite of Gene as because of him.
Totally. Gene actually publicly stated that he didn't even consider Wrath of Khan as canon.

Honestly, I think if WoK were released in 2009 instead of JJ's Trek, it would have received just as much hate. I mean, WoK was basically a remake of TMP, with the main changes being more action, more battles, more explosions, and a revenge-driven villain.

Pretty much sounds like the same complaints about Abrams to me (for the most part).
Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 375
# 112
07-29-2013, 10:25 AM
uh TOS everyones shooting at you or attacking each other in a bar fight, with a rare episode involving some question about morality or ethics.

Wrath of Khan was a seamless transition to me, you had vengeful Khan, and whaddya know. he's shooting at kirk! even motion picture opening scene was action packed violence..

cue Next Generation, DS9, Voyager, and Enterprise.... they're still shootn at us!

man... they always shootin at us...

oh and don't forget the occasional 'peace' episode cause were the 'good' guys bit. real art I tell you!
Lyndon Brewer: 20% chance to capture enemy ship for 60 seconds on successful use of boarding party.

cause sometimes its party time!

Last edited by lykum; 07-29-2013 at 10:28 AM.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 398
# 113
07-29-2013, 10:35 AM
Honestly, the only thing I hate about Abrams' Trek is that I always get caught up in debates defending it and wind up pointing out all the bad things about classic Trek movies I love so dearly.

FYI, I'm not a zealot for the Abram films. The Kirk era movies are still my all-time favorite Trek iterations. I just think the Abram movies are a fun romp and give a good Trek fix.

Sure, it's not the same fix we got from TNG, so I can appreciate how TNG fans wouldn't like it. But as someone who grew up with TOS, I don't really have any problems with it. It took the original show 40 years to fully develop these characters. Abrams has had about 4 hours. Considering that - and the fact that he had a mandate to make a movie the masses would enjoy - I'd say he did a fine job.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,765
# 114
07-29-2013, 10:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonsills View Post
what Tos Was, And What Tng And Ds9 Became, Were Almost As Much In spite Of Gene As because Of Him.
^^^^^^^
Qft
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 967
# 115
07-29-2013, 10:57 AM
According to an argument between CBS Television Studios and JJ Abrams, "Star Trek: The Original Series" is still making allot of money.

Link: "How the Battle Over 'Star Trek' Rights Killed J.J. Abrams' Grand Ambitions"

Quote:
Much to the dismay of Bad Robot, CBS' merchandising arm continued to create memorabilia and products based on the cast of the original 1960s series and market them to Trekkies. The production company did market research and found that there was brand confusion between Abrams' rebooted Enterprise crew and the one starring William Shatner and DeForest Kelley.
Quote:
TheWrap has learned that Bad Robot asked CBS to stop making products featuring the original cast, but talks broke down over money. The network was making roughly $20 million a year on that merchandise and had no incentive to play nice with its former corporate brother, the individual said. In response, the company scaled back its ambitions to have "Star Trek's" storylines play out with television shows, spin-off films and online components, something Abrams had been eager to accomplish.
Abrams wanted to end all "Star Trek: The Original Series" merchandising. Movies, novels, tv-series, etc... If Abrams was able to have free reign, "Star Trek" would have been dismantlement. "Star Trek: TOS" makes $20 million dollars a year.

Quote:
"Right now the 'Star Trek' movies are movies," Gomez said. "There is no apparent ongoing transmedia strategy behind them, just a handful of licensing opportunities around the release of 'Into Darkness.'
Imagine telling everyone that "Star Trek: TOS" never existed?

As long as Abrams is in charge of the movies, I personally think all "Star Trek" merchandising is in trouble.

Last edited by linyive; 07-29-2013 at 11:03 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,375
# 116
07-29-2013, 11:05 AM
A Fine Job
So ripping off one of the best films in Star Trek ever and making new trek nothing more than a generic sci fi film.
Lets just look at a few things that was used
1. The Original Khan was name Khan Noonien Singh and was Indian which fit with the name
The new Khan is british and fit the name Harriman better than Khan

2. Old Khan used his mind to try and outwit Kirk tactically and thought he had strength he knew that may not always win the day
New Khan relied more on brute force rather than tatical thinking

3. Kirks death scene and how he died was a direct plagarism on Spocks death in the Wrath of Khan

4. Spocks KHANNNNN Scream was just plain cheese when Kirk did it in WOK it fitted as he is human and had a reason. Spock's just was plain annoying there was no need and quite frankly irritated me.

5. Kirks resurrection
Okay so since there was no Genesis device what d the use to resurrect Kirk. Magic blood Again irritating.

That is just a few things that annoyed me about STID and why I rank it as one of the worst ST films of all time the only one worse that ID is Star Trek V.

But not a fan of JJ Trek and will love to hear the complaints of the Star Wars fan when he messes with there beloved franchise.

Be Prepared for a Alternate timeline. Destruction of a planet possibly Tattoine, The Return of Jar Jar Binks and when the falcon drops into a debris field we will see the enterprise flying past.
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,375
# 117
07-29-2013, 11:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by linyive View Post
According to an argument between CBS Television Studios and JJ Abrams, "Star Trek: The Original Series" is still making allot of money.

Link: "How the Battle Over 'Star Trek' Rights Killed J.J. Abrams' Grand Ambitions"




Abrams wanted to end all "Star Trek: The Original Series" merchandising. Movies, novels, tv-series, etc... If Abrams was able to have free reign, "Star Trek" would have been dismantlement. "Star Trek: TOS" makes $20 million dollars a year.


Imagine telling everyone that "Star Trek: TOS" never existed?

As long as Abrams is in charge of the movies, I personally think all "Star Trek" merchandising is in trouble.
JJ has ruined Trek I have seen the comics that have spawned of the film and all there doing is rehashing the storylines from the scripts there isnt a single original story in them as far as I have seen in the previews.

I at least have original TOS novels still coming out and need these to remain as there only trek fix I can get now with the original cast.
NO TO ARC
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Brigadier General Jokag IKS Gorkan
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 7,154
# 118
07-29-2013, 11:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by linyive View Post
"Star Trek: TOS" makes $20 million dollars a year.
It makes $20 million for CBS. It doesn't make a dime for Paramount. And even that $20 million ends up being diffused via royalties to Gene's estate, the actors, etc.

And then you have Into Darkness, which is the 9th highest grossing movie this year at $450 million, and that doesn't even include the hundred million more it will make in licensing to HBO or Showtime, DVD and Blue Ray sales, etc this year - and it's merchandising will make millions more per year for years to come.

It's about greed on both sides. Not about trying to destroy one or the other.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,735
# 119
07-29-2013, 11:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by amahood View Post
Bout the only show I like today now is "The Walking Dead". Great show, (as long as they don't ruin it). It's got originality, and now other tv channels head leaders are now wondering why it's so good.

Not once will they realize , it's due to originality and good thinking, instead of just copying.
You know, I had kind of skimmed past this earlier - but now its irony is knocking on my frontal lobes.

The TV show "The Walking Dead" is a loose remake of a comic-book serial - and one of the most popular characters on the show, whose name escapes me (I don't watch, so..), isn't even from the book, but is in fact a creation of the TV writers. And this is to be lauded for its pure originality, as opposed to the Abrams Trek films?

I mean, it's a bit like talking about how "brilliant" and "original" the HBO series Game of Thrones is...
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But I'm young enough to remember the future, the way things ought to be...

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Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,388
# 120
07-29-2013, 12:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonsills View Post
Some of y'all really need to go read about what Roddenberry thought of every Trek movie after The Motionless Picture. Or how many of the things we disliked about the first two seasons of TNG were also Roddenberry's babies (like, for instance, Wesley Crusher, a Mary Sue for Eugene Wesley Roddenberry).

What TOS was, and what TNG and DS9 became, were almost as much in spite of Gene as because of him.
I admit, I don't know the full details, but I do know that Roddenberry had a beef with the way Meyer took things. My guess, would be that he didn't like what Meyer was doing, but possibly lacked the clout to reign him in as he used to try and do while filming TOS. I can only imagine how frustrating it must be for a writer to have their characters and settings used in a way other than originally intended, but being unable to do anything about it. I can only imagine it might be like a guy getting his buddy to take his wife to a movie for company, but them then hooking up...

Either way though, those movies were still done with Gene's 'awareness' (if not 100% approval) rather than someone thinking they would be a good way of getting more money in by riding on someone else's artistic coat-tails

Last edited by marcusdkane; 07-29-2013 at 03:09 PM.
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