Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 470
# 1 Why "ranks" for pets?
07-19-2013, 10:20 AM
I wondered what this mechanic shall promote or prevent.

- So far pets were often re-launched on cooldown
- Sometimes players launch pets when a target is to be "spiked" down, i.e. the fighters get launched and immediately launch their torpedoes at the target


I see "ranks" preventing people launching pets on cooldown, as this would forfeit the damage bonus of higher rank over time.
The second maneuver is still possible, but gets slightly discouraged as it would forfeit the damage bonus of higher rank as well.


Is there more/another reason behind the ranks?

Because
1. I wonder why pets should grow stronger over time at all
2. Why 5 ranks and 5 minutes? I have yet to see fighters surviving that long in combat.
(Rather 3 ranks over 3 minutes maybe?)

The new pet UI element is quite nice.
P.S. I moved it to the upper right next to the minimap, what's your favorite position for it?
Ensign
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 12
# 2
07-19-2013, 01:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by salamiinferno View Post
Activating your Hangar Bay while pets are already summoned will no longer replace active pets, but will only fill in missing pets.

Neither of the reasons you mentioned for relaunching pets are going to be viable. The only way to be able to 'spike' is to let them die or not launch them until you want the spike. That said, when they fix docking, you will be able to recall them and then spike the whole lot by giving them the attack command.

As for the ranks, I see it as a direct nerf to pvp vs a boost to long pve. I do agree that 5 min to reach the top rank is absurd.
Commander
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 403
# 3
07-19-2013, 03:34 PM
Well for frigates and runabouts ranks seems fine but fighters suffer badly it's more like a major nerf to them.
Fighters just don't last long enough to rank and even if they do make it to full rank they tend to blow up in one shot so you can't even dock them to repair them not that it's working right now anyways. Stalker fighters are particularly bad I suspect because they get in close to use their anti proton sweep. I've had type 8 shuttles substantially out last the stalkers which I assume is because they're keeping their distance because they have less hull strength so I can't see any other reason why they're out lasting them.
Scorpion fighters seem to do reasonably well probably due to battle cloak the stalkers mask energy signature is a poor mans cloak in comparison.
Peregrine also do badly at first but they seem to do better than the stalkers once they level up I think they're doing more damage than the stalkers once they level so it somewhat compensates.

Last edited by vonhellsting; 07-19-2013 at 03:42 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,320
# 4
07-19-2013, 09:32 PM
It's a nerf/re-balance hidden behind requested features, IMO. We get a shiny new interface that lets us finally keep track of our pets and individual hangar commands (requested quite often) and rank up (a few requests for this too), and the devs get to address some balance issues (like pet abilities getting effectively a huge cooldown reduction each time a fresh wave is sent out to replace the old) while most players are distracted.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 247
# 5
07-19-2013, 10:10 PM
I agree with you that it seems an overly complex feature that in practice will add little to gameplay. And the reason seems to be unknown, as Cryptic had stated pet dps wasn't the problem. The ability to spam pet special abilities was...but that doesn't get fixed by the ranking mechanic, it gets fixed by the 'add to wing' instead of 'replace'.

If it were up to me, I'd not add it to the game. Too many issues and it seems clunky rather than cool.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 73
# 6
07-20-2013, 03:37 AM
I'd say it encourages smart and careful use of pets. Like calling them back to the hangar to refill in combat breaks to make sure they -do- survive long enough to rank up.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 7
07-20-2013, 05:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thibash View Post
I agree with you that it seems an overly complex feature that in practice will add little to gameplay. And the reason seems to be unknown, as Cryptic had stated pet dps wasn't the problem. The ability to spam pet special abilities was...but that doesn't get fixed by the ranking mechanic, it gets fixed by the 'add to wing' instead of 'replace'.

If it were up to me, I'd not add it to the game. Too many issues and it seems clunky rather than cool.

Part of it could also be to address the fact that most carriers can basically do everything a Sci ship can do but better, with pets, massive hulls and generally superior BOFF layouts (multiple Ltc).

Ensign
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 12
# 8
07-21-2013, 12:13 PM
The more I think about this, the more I come to the conclusion that the ranks are reversed to how they should be.

Pets should fly out of the hanger fresh and ready for combat. Pilots are rested, weapons are fully loaded, ship is fully fueled and ready to go. The longer they spend out there the more fuel and weapons they use, the more the damage the ship has taken weakens it, and the more fatigued the pilot becomes.

Perhaps the answer to this is to launch the pets at a 5 star rank and let them rank DOWN over time. Their rank could be restored (not instantly) by docking (refueling, rearming, swapping crew). The longer you let your pets stay out there the more vulnerable and less effective they become, and with an inability to just launch new and replace them you have to make the choice between letting them weaken until they die for new strong pets, or dock them to restore their effectiveness.


Lets face it, the only times your pets are going to survive a real fight for 5 min to rank all the way up are if you don't need their help.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 850
# 9
07-22-2013, 01:15 AM
While it may be more "realistic" to have fighters start out at peak strength and weaken over time, the point of having them gain ranks over time is to provide a strong incentive to keep them alive as opposed to treating them as throwaway cannon fodder--the longer they survive, the more you get rewarded.
How many Starfleet Engineers does it take to exchange an Anti-positronic Photon Emitter?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 858
# 10
07-22-2013, 09:52 AM
Ever play Command & Conquer?

Units gain Veterancy the more they're in combat.

This is like that, congratulations Carrier Captains, you have your own mini-RTS game to play!
Constant exposure to the same opinions leads to continual reinforcement of ideas until eventually, any challenge, no matter what form it takes, is going to be met with a disproportionate sense of outrage. Room for reasoned discussion can no longer occur.

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