Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,660
If you dislike it (I really like it be honest, it may even be my favourite series, personally),

Why?

I may need to write these down, and use them as part of my report.

(For your information, I am aiming to try and get a new Star Trek series)
Hopefully I'll come back from my break; this break is fun; I play intellectual games.

I hope STO get's better ...
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 680
# 2
07-25-2013, 04:35 AM
I watched it all the way through for the first time earlier this year, having just done the same for DS9. I wouldn't say I actively disliked it, but it never quite seemed to hit DS9's high notes. There was always some little niggle about it, Neelix was supremely irritating in the early episodes, and by the second half of the show it seemed to have become Star Trek: Seven of Nine (with special guest stars, the crew of Voyager).

I think the most disappointing thing for me though, was the final episode. There was no sense of closure. You didn't see Voyager land on Earth, you didn't even get a 'goodbye' shot of all the main characters on the bridge. They pop out of the conduit, half the characters seem to have wandered off to goodness knows where, and the last shot is just Voyager and some escorting ships heading towards Earth. And that's not even mentioning the completely out of nowhere romance plotline between Seven and Chakotay. It was a very unsatisfying ending, especially when compared to the TNG and DS9 finales.

I do also agree with those who accuse the writers of being rather inconsistent, especially with Janeway. In one particular episode, she demotes Paris from Lt. to Ensign for breaking the Prime Directive. In the very next episode, Janeway is hiding a group of refugees aboard Voyager as they cross through the space of their enemy. Sympathetic, but still, about as big a breach of the Prime Directive as you can get. XD

This character is why I don't play my Romulan any more. Tovan Khev is NOT my BFF! Get him off my bridge!
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,742
# 3
07-25-2013, 04:44 AM
I liked Voyager, but i think it could have been better.

I think the 'reset' nature of some episodes was annoying. voyager would get battered to hell in one episode and the next episode it was working perfectly. they could have done a better job on making the journey seem more dangerous. It did not have to be drastic but making things a little bit harder each season as their supplies dwindled and key systems could not be repaired would have added to the tension.

I would have also liked the characters arcs to be a little slower. it seems the two crews integrated very quickly, far quicker than in real life. i think the marquis crew should have stayed separate for at least a season to prove themselves. even then tension should have run higher.

The Borg become overused to the point where they were no longer that much of a threat. TNG usually beat them by the skin of their teeth and by luck. voyager seemed to outsmart them 3 times a season. even to the point where they got themselves assimilated as part of the plan. it weakened the impact of being assimilated. having your humanity stripped away, possibly losing an arm or a eye.

And not being Voyagers fault so much, but it was not as good as DS9 or TNG in my eyes. Its always hard to follow great shows that went before it.

Basically it all felt a bit too safe and cosy at times.

House of Cards - Lvl 46 Fed mission
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 153
# 4
07-25-2013, 04:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jumpingjs View Post
If you dislike it (I really like it be honest, it may even be my favourite series, personally),

Why?

I may need to write these down, and use them as part of my report.

(For your information, I am aiming to try and get a new Star Trek series)
really i don't know why people don't like it. i grew up watching trek, born in 92, i've seen every ep as they were airing, except the original, animated series and a few seasons of next gen. but voy is still my favorite. really the only ones i don't really like is ds9, to much political and religion in it for my liking and the original, mostly because of Shatner s acting or lack there of.

but you ask people and most of them say it's because of bad writing, or couldn't relate to characters. or that there would be no way of a starship to last out there that long without a refit, or so on. now i'm not talking about everyone, for everyone has their own opinion about which show they like.

for me i thought that all of the shows have plot holes, or contradiction between what was once put down. character wise, the only character i didn't like on the show was 7 of 9, then again i was a kid. as for the ship, she has gone through repairs and in between eps are weeks if not months, not to mention that b'elanna did make janway land once for a refit of the warp nacelles.

PS. if you need any help ask away, i've been devising my own show pitch for years, just been too busy to do anything about it, basic out line is there though.
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Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,521
# 5
07-25-2013, 05:58 AM
Thing with Voyager is it was so inconsistent. It has two episodes in my 5 worst in all of Trek and dominates by 10 worst list. It has some of the best developed characters, some of the worst caricatures, and a god-of-everything Mary Sue to rival Wesley. It randomly slams from awful to awesome and back again, sometimes episode to episode, sometimes within the same episode by combining a brilliant A-plot with a brain meltingly bad B-plot (or vice versa).

Janeway is an odd captain. The worse the writers make her as a captain, the better she is as a character. When she's being shown as a good leader, terrible writing or the poor leading cast ruins the episode around her. When they show her as an unfair dictator using rank like a whip to force the crew into obedience (Scorpion is my favorite example), she shines as one of the most interesting captains.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 962
# 6
07-25-2013, 06:05 AM
Although I like Voyager, it is my least favourite. My main gripes boil down to this:


Too. Much. Technobabble.


TNG and DS9 used a little technobabble to create solutions that basically replaced our current day tech with something a little more futuristic, but the basic principle was the same, so you could understand.


Voyager went extreme with it. And just started sprouting gibberish that held no real world connection half the time. They may as well have just been using magic. The charachters were also bland for the first few years.


I also hated the complete lack of continuity. Small hull damage can be patched over, but the horrific damage suffered in Killing Game should have been present for weeks after, unless they put into an alien starbase for repairs (this is something I loved Enterprise for!). And if they just do this off screen, then put in a throw away line in the captain's log at the start of the episode that after being in some alien starbase for 3 weeks getting repairs and restocking supplies and weapons, we are back on route. It's unobtrusive to the story of that ep and just helps ease episode to episode.



On saying that, I will say I loved Voyager when Seven turned up. Purely for the many, many discussions Seeven and Janeway had regarding what it means to be human, all those morality tales and discussions. Both points were valid, and to me, it was scenes like that where Voyager really shined.
*******************************************

A Romulan Strike Team, Missing Farmers and an ancient base on a Klingon Border world. But what connects them? Find out in my First Foundary mission: 'The Jeroan Farmer Escapade'
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 12,519
# 7
07-25-2013, 06:07 AM
Yeah, voy had some absolutely stupid plots, but a lot of really good ones... Some of them that really got my attention were the one where Voyager got stuck in the event horizon of a mini-black hole, that was just dumb.... another example was where a temporal paradox almost destroyed a planet, but the temporal paradox was caused by itself?

The Seska episodes were some of the best. Especially the one where a holographic recreation of Seska tries to take over the ship.
HAIL HYDRA!

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I can haz joystick!
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Captain
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 2,457
# 8
07-25-2013, 06:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by grylak View Post
They may as well have just been using magic.
I think if you showed someone from the 1960s an iPhone, then it would probably be called a magical box

I do agree that VOY had a lot ... a lot ... of technobabble. Frankly, it was typically the saving grace for a lot of plot.

Quote:
"Oh noz, the replicator is broken."

"Well, scan for tetryon particles and adjust the verteron alternating field point oh-nine nanoticks."

"By Saint Booger and all the saints at the backside door of Purgatory, it worked!"
But I let it go because its super-science fiction and the suspension of disbelief is already at a high level. It's everything else about the show that makes it my favorite ST series
Kathryn S. Beringer - The Dawn Patrol

Solaris build - Veritatum Liquido Cernene
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 12,519
# 9
07-25-2013, 07:31 AM
A lot of Voyager's stories involved attempting to "understand" things that the Federation had never seen before. Needless to say even half-baked explanations of thing slike that are nearly solid technobabble.
HAIL HYDRA!

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I can haz joystick!
MMOs aren't charities. Corporations are supposed to make a profit. It's what they do.
Republic Veteran
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 170
# 10
07-25-2013, 07:33 AM
The ship was shaped like a Vulva to emphasize the high estrogen content. It was made for men who like to be dominated by non-men. A borg with high heels and breast implants? Really?
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