Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 421
# 1 Excuses, excuses.
08-08-2013, 08:56 AM
Excuse Generator!

I took a break from PvP for a bit because I was getting pretty frustrated with connection issues (I live in the boonies, it's to be expected). Rather than playing the "you only killed me because I was lagging" card I figured it would just be easier for everyone. Besides, doffing provides more than enough time wasting opportunities and they actually do what I tell them (like a boss) .

Still, I missed some parts of PvP so last week I tried to give it another shot. Now I have to admit, I'm rusty as hell and it's been harder to get back into the swing of things than I expected. While I'm trying to get myself back up to speed, I want to rule out some of the basic stuff that might be beyond my control (or propensity for making mistakes).

Rubber banding in PvP has become more common than ever (it was bad when I took a break but nothing to this extent). I entered a Cap and Hold that was already in progress. Everyone was fighting near the abandoned star base (around 25km away) and I looked like was was goose stepping trying to leave the spawn area, lol. So I ran some tracerts and nettests and this is what I got.

Microsoft Windows [Version 6.1.7601]
Copyright (c) 2009 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.


Tracing route to [x]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 2 ms 2 ms 1 ms []
2 53 ms 50 ms 51 ms []
3 51 ms 51 ms 49 ms []
4 88 ms 63 ms 63 ms [
5 69 ms 71 ms 71 ms [20]
6 70 ms 69 ms 69 ms []
7 * 62 ms 63 ms []
8 72 ms 69 ms 69 ms [208.17
9 65 ms 69 ms 85 ms [204.70.
10 69 ms 71 ms 69 ms []
11 78 ms 76 ms 75 ms []

12 83 ms 83 ms 83 ms []
13 79 ms 83 ms 83 ms
14 83 ms 83 ms 83 ms []
15 83 ms 83 ms 91 ms [
16 88 ms 89 ms 89 ms [216.52.
17 83 ms 83 ms 81 ms

Trace complete.
contacting nettest server..
Local IP:
Ping: 71.5 msec
Port: 80: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 80: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 443: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 443: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7255: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7255: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7003: 58 KB/sec 2 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7003: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7202: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7202: 58 KB/sec 2 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7499: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7499: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 80: 58 KB/sec 2 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Idle NIC bandwidth Send: 0 KB/sec Recv: 0 KB/sec
Aside from some random SNRs or occasionally long load times when going from one zone to the next, I don't typically have much difficulty with these issues outside of PvP. Is there anything in these numbers what would help me understand what's happening with my lag, rubber banding, or misfired weapons and abilities in PvP?
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,101
# 2
08-08-2013, 09:09 AM
Those times are about 20-30% shorter than mine but as I live in the UK that is expected.

When I had a rubber banding issue I changed my wireless receiver to a Netgear and added a range extender as my PC is about 12m from the router, since then no lag, no rubber banding, perfect and now receiving at 243 mpbs. Only issue I had was local radio interference so changed the channel which sorted that instantly.
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 421
# 3
08-08-2013, 09:16 AM
I have Century Link extended reach DSL. Hrmn... I do have a wireless router but my computer is connected to it (the router sits right beside the tower too).
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 543
# 4
08-08-2013, 09:19 AM
I ran a wire and that sped up everything. I will never go back to wireless except in necessary situations.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 5
08-08-2013, 09:21 AM
Originally Posted by stevehale View Post
I have Century Link extended reach DSL. Hrmn... I do have a wireless router but my computer is connected to it (the router sits right beside the tower too).
How hot does it get usually?

I've often had all manner of issues with routers as they start to show a little age and many times its been from heat.

Ultimatum's jury rig for hot routers

* 2 to 4 x 5lb weightlifting plates (can be found stupid cheap, many people already probably have them from some super lame bench set by a mass brand like weider - you do not need "olympic style" plates).
* A working freezer/fridge
* Beer

1) Place all plates in freezer until cold.
2) Place 1 cold plate under router, router needs to be horizontal for as much contact as possible.
3) Once current plate gets hot, swap out with 1 cold one from the freezer.
4) Keep a beer in the fridge so you can get beers and cold plates at the same time.
5) Drink the beer while gaming. Do not pour it on the router.

There's a good chance this might not even remotely be connected to your actual problem.

Last edited by ussultimatum; 08-08-2013 at 09:24 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,101
# 6
08-08-2013, 09:22 AM
Are those the ping times when you get the rubber banding?

If it varies then perhaps a hub in your connection somewhere is suffering from very high utilisation. There are lots more guys who know a lot more about it than me but I hope you get it fixed Steve.
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 421
# 7
08-08-2013, 09:35 AM
I'll see if I can set it on some ice packs, lol.

The tests were actually run with nothing, else open (no game, browser, etc). Does running either of these things hurt the connection while I'm playing? The rubber banding isn't constant, sometimes it's a few seconds, other times it's a few minutes depending on when I have to respawn or whether I can get away.

It's hard to get away when you are constantly flying sideways, jumping, dropping or back stepping. I kind of want to see if I can record it but it sounds like a lot of work for a weak technical mind and I think most people know what rubber banding looks like.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,301
# 8
08-08-2013, 11:58 AM
Generally speaking. Generally. When your client is loading up a new zone from the server it is...loading up an entire new zone from the server.

Depending on the zone that can be a large amount of information. For PVP zones you can be SURE that that is a large amount of information. Did you know that if you are in a zone when someone zones in, you will 'see' them before they actually drop the loading screen? Just saying that THAT loading screen is your client not being ready to paint the zone info on your monitor. But you're IN the zone. Anyway keep that in mind.

Okay. In sector space you zone, maybe it takes a few seconds, no biggie. You get in, and you're IN. You likely do not lag. Why? because there's like ZERO extra objects. So there's a few other players and encounters. NOT processor intensive.

PVP not so much. Your client gets that there's a station, some sensors, some asteroids, blah blah blah and it DROPS you into the zone. NICE! HAI GUYZS I ISZ HERE! Well ok. Your "ship" starts to function in the zone. Part of that functionality is 'scanning' for objects. You know these objects as 'SPAM'. Don't think "oh I can't see it so it isn't 'there' yet. It is. The ENTIRE zone is in your client. So you see what happened? You come into a match in progress you are trying to process a LARGE amount of queries. Good luck!

So your bandwith and your processor/gpu are handling a certain level of information fine. You burst over that and there's a jam.

And. Also. This is a bit different than if you said "I was in the middle of a fight, everything was fine, nothing changed, just suddenly I was rubberbanding". That could POSSIBLY be an external issue.

If you were in the middle of a fight and SUDDENLY 3 carriers launched wings, everyone triggered photonic fleet and nimbus distress and TS3 and THEN you rubberbanded, we're back to the original diagnosis.

If I don't respond to posts on this forum don't be offended. I don't sub or follow any of them.
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 749
# 9
08-08-2013, 02:12 PM
Maybe your computer/router is just trying to spare us from your presence.
The first we heard of getting new PvP maps "soon" was in August of 2010. We're consistently told something will be coming with the "next" update. Absolutely nothing has come to PvP since launch.

I think it's finally time Cryptic stopped stringing us along, don't you?
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,448
# 10
08-08-2013, 02:42 PM
For personal security reasons, I'd snip the 1st 5 hops or so off of your traceroute output. Enough to leave out your info and enough of your isp's info to cast doubt on where you're coming from.

Nothing you listed indicates you're issue was a network one. You could try other things like installing wireshark (it's free) and running it. But, I think you'd have a tough time figuring out what the output meant. You could size pings to see if it's an mtu issues, but nothing points to that at this point.

Fyi, w/pings and tracerts one thing to look for in addition to the delay is the "jitter" the difference between the response time. This could have explained your rubberbanding some, but there didn't seem to be an indication of that.

DSL value is dependent on how close you are to a "Central Office" or CO of the ISP as well as the quality of the lines it's running over.

For windows I'm not really sure of a good resource monitoring tool.

Can't get into it much here, but if you see me online I can get into potential nefarious things people maybe using. That shouldn't be ubiquitous across all your matches, so I doubt that's your issue.

Cryptic has stealth installed a peer to peer sharing app, dump it. Also, check for any other app that maybe running in the background that could be chewing up your dsl resources. One thing to keep in mind w/DSL is the upload (ei going from your pc/rtr) is much smaller than the bandwidth you can download with. It wouldn't take much for a rogue app to screw that up.
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