Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 246
I flew all type of ships in STO, and I don't think escorts have advantages over any other ship classes.

Escort dps is great with its alpha strike. However, they're fragile. It's kill 1st or or die.

Cruiser has low dps but great shield and hull. To win vs escort in pvp... all you need to do is know how to cancel out its alpha strike.. I seen lot cruiser setup vs escort... and they're totally wrong.

Sci vessel can deal with escort better than cruiser... as long you know how to cancel out the alpha strike.

There are 3 playing classes and 3 main types of ship. That means 9 setups combine with boff/doff skills and weapon types, we got a lot of configuration to play with. Therefore if you don't know how to handle a cruiser or a sci... it doesn't mean they're weak, Escort, like any dpser type in mmo, is the easiest to play with but boring. Cruiser/Sci ships require skill full mastery. If you only know how shoot... flight an the escort It requires no skill or brain. However, if you want to master the art of true spaceship combat flight a cruiser or sci vessel.
Captain
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 927
# 2
06-26-2013, 06:38 PM
its because every important mission in this game is timed..

try to do an ISE with 5 cruisers.. you will be very close to not making optional if you even get it at all.


now 5 escorts, you will have 8 minutes left..
[12:35] Vessel Two of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 225232 (271723) Plasma Damage to you with Plasma Lance.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 246
# 3
06-26-2013, 07:00 PM
I don't think the complain about escort overpower has anything to do with pve but pvp.

If you're talking about eSTF, then cruisers have no problem splitting out dps... if you setup it correctly. Think cannons and alpha strike. In some cruisers such as the bortasque, you can out dmg an escort The odessey pump out lot dps with cannons/torp setup. I can easily kill the cube or guard the probes with my setup... unlike other cruisers using beams. Off course cannons only work for cruisers that have enough tac boff. If you cant have rapidfire/scattervolley, cannons setup is crap.

However, ppl complain about escort mostly because they lose in pvp. As I said, escort has only 1 trick - alpha strike. If you know how to cancel this trick, escort is out. And it's pretty simple to do it.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 376
# 4
06-26-2013, 07:50 PM
Um my Fleet AC only uses beams and will shred, cube, probes, generators all 3 at same time with FAW and torp spread. EptW3 + aux2bat.

Now as to why escorts are OP. Beams take more energy but do less dmg, DHC do more dmg and use up less energy per cycle. Cruisers a tanks but have low defense value. Escorts a glass cannons but have the most defense.

In the begining escorts had weak shields, now fleet escorts have 1.0 shield mods like a lot of cruisers. In the begining escorts had weak hulls. Long time ago the escort hulls were upped and now most escorts have 40-50k hulls. Escorts used to be limited in sci and eng, now tons of them have LTC of either. DHC used to not have +10 crit d, and was on a global cooldown with other cannons, that was removed. There has been no change to beams since launch.

All in all time had given escorts tons of boosts. While little has aided sci/cruisers. When all optionals in STFs became time based the game became majorly focused on DPS, nothing dps better then a good player in an escort.

Are escorts OP? In the hands of a skilled player they are damn hard to kill, will shred you in a second. Even in the hands of a skilled player a sci ship/cruiser will have a much tougher time doing the same. Though if thats your goal go KDF/Romulan and get cruiser that mount DHC.

My opinion, ya they are OP vs when we started the game by a massive margin. But are they unkillable? Nope. Cruisers on the other hand has had a much less noticeable power creep or i should say less sever. Sci ship skills got nerfed, so they arent a lot better off then the start of the game.

Problem is any boost to sci/eng skills help escorts as well. New embassy consoles/Dilthium mine consoles are a prime example. Hard to close any power gap when we all share the same items, except for DHC. Id rather they made beams have +10 acc to balance out +10 crit d on DHC, and give each other type of weapon its on advantage like DC having +1% crit etc.

Last edited by jtoney3448; 06-26-2013 at 07:53 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,204
# 5
06-26-2013, 08:22 PM
Probably because they keep stacking positives for everything without adding a negative to them and made everything DPS's oriented makes the escort the ideal choice for the majority of events. If they added a ranking system that includes the other class skills rather than DPS alone for leaderboards then the cruisers and sci ships would be equally chosen for PvE. If its going to be DPS's for leaderboards in PvE then all 3 class should be able to do equal damage.

As for PvP they really need to seperate it from PvE and for every item that gives a boost in one thing add a weakness to another such as armor negating an escorts agility by X% making them easier to hit and an ACC X2 beam against one could be an ACC X3 ontop of having a more difficult time keeping whatever you are firing at inside the arc. PvP should also be more equal, sci ships should get a boost to shields, cruisers a boost to hull and escorts to DPS's where everyone is exactly on the same footing before consoles and weapons are added into the mix. All default weapons with no consoles and it should be a battle of attrition. Add a console that boosts X you lose an equal amount of Y.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 246
# 6
06-26-2013, 08:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtoney3448 View Post
Um my Fleet AC only uses beams and will shred, cube, probes, generators all 3 at same time with FAW and torp spread. EptW3 + aux2bat.

Now as to why escorts are OP. Beams take more energy but do less dmg, DHC do more dmg and use up less energy per cycle. Cruisers a tanks but have low defense value. Escorts a glass cannons but have the most defense.

In the begining escorts had weak shields, now fleet escorts have 1.0 shield mods like a lot of cruisers. In the begining escorts had weak hulls. Long time ago the escort hulls were upped and now most escorts have 40-50k hulls. Escorts used to be limited in sci and eng, now tons of them have LTC of either. DHC used to not have +10 crit d, and was on a global cooldown with other cannons, that was removed. There has been no change to beams since launch.

All in all time had given escorts tons of boosts. While little has aided sci/cruisers. When all optionals in STFs became time based the game became majorly focused on DPS, nothing dps better then a good player in an escort.

Are escorts OP? In the hands of a skilled player they are damn hard to kill, will shred you in a second. Even in the hands of a skilled player a sci ship/cruiser will have a much tougher time doing the same. Though if thats your goal go KDF/Romulan and get cruiser that mount DHC.

My opinion, ya they are OP vs when we started the game by a massive margin. But are they unkillable? Nope. Cruisers on the other hand has had a much less noticeable power creep or i should say less sever. Sci ship skills got nerfed, so they arent a lot better off then the start of the game.

Problem is any boost to sci/eng skills help escorts as well. New embassy consoles/Dilthium mine consoles are a prime example. Hard to close any power gap when we all share the same items, except for DHC. Id rather they made beams have +10 acc to balance out +10 crit d on DHC, and give each other type of weapon its on advantage like DC having +1% crit etc.
No one says that beams aint good. Beams have different playing style. Cannon is all about alpha strike. No alpha strike play style... no point using cannons. Beams have more firing arc compare to cannons. Hence, less dmg per beam, but if u're slow moving turtle, the beams wide firing arc compensate for the low dps.

You cant compare fleet escort stats to non-fleet ship. All fleet versions have better shield/hull. Fleet cruiser still have more shield/hull than fleet escort.

I don't think dps is a factor in my choice of ship. I flight cruiser/carrier/sci vessel 'cause of the skills/play style.

Escorts can shred anything in seconds due to its alpha strike. You know how to cancel the alpha strike, escort isn't a threat or op.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,275
# 7
06-26-2013, 08:27 PM
This game is completely based on damage. Nothing else. For high-end PVE like Elite STFs, damage is absolute, sovereign, the "One And Only King." As someone earlier mentioned, try doing these Elite STFs with SCI Vessels and Cruisers only. Try doing the same thing with Escorts only. I guarantee you that the Escorts will **B-L-A-Z-E** through the mission without breaking a sweat. Sure, some idiot will probably die once if he was a clueless sap, but the sheer firepower being put out will minimize losses. The firepower will let them burn through mission very quickly and attain the optionals much more easily. Do Elite STFs with alot of Cruisers or SCI Vessels takes much, much longer and will be a close shave when it comes to doing the mission in time and making the optionals.

PVP. This is where it actually gets mixed up more, compared to even PVE. The best PVP groups are ideally balanced. SCI, Cruisers, Escort ships. The ideal is also cross support. You'll see the organized Premade groups are balanced in composition. For PUGs though, an Escort heavy group can be quite nasty, but are vulnerable in not being able to do Cross Support like a balanced group.

For PVP, the end goal is good spike damage. This is what outright destroys an enemy at the start of a fight. This is what it takes to get past the tough defenses of today, which Escorts are well capable of. Don't let the "smaller" shield mod of Escorts fool you. Combine that with the faster speeds that bring a bonus to defense, and great maneuverability to move a weak shield facing away from dangerous sources, Escorts have superior defenses despite "weaker" shields. Not to mention they do not have weak hulls in STO. Escort hulls are not that far off in hull points compared to most Cruisers. Hell, Escorts have MORE hull points than Science Vessels.

Anyways, Damage makes the world go around in STO. If you're not doing your part in pouring out tremendous damage, or being an Escort's Healbot/Healboat, then you are a liability in both PVP and high-end PVE.

I wish it wasn't like that in STO, but that is how it is now. At least at the beginning of STO's release, everything was fun and viable. Not now. If you're not a damage dealer or playing subordinate to an Escort, you are a problem.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,282
# 8
06-26-2013, 08:29 PM
To OP, because many people don't know how to play a cruiser/sci ship. Most of them try to use them the same way they use an escort, and fail.

The escorts are not OP. The other ships are slightly underpowered IMO, but not by much. I wish they'd increase sci power damage, and do something for the beams.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 246
# 9
06-26-2013, 08:29 PM
Btw, if ppl think FAW is the most important skill in cruiser pvp, then they're totally wrong.
Captain
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,181
# 10
06-26-2013, 08:40 PM
Play Gorn Minefield a Escort will get 1st place assuming the person knows what he is doing.

Their is no mission that is designed for Cruisers or Sci ships to get 1st place like their is for Escorts except for Cyrstalline Catastrophe mission. Just that 1 mission for them compared to multiples for Escorts.

The speed at which Escorts can kill stuff is just to high in comparison to other ship types. Yes a Escort is built for destroying things but the difference for it compared to other type of ships is just to high.
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