Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,559
# 51
12-23-2013, 04:17 AM
Its a battlecruiser with singularity abilities instead of cruiser commands.

And how it performs against a Scimitar, depends on the Scimitar variant.

Because it can out-tank all but the Falchion.
Let us wear Swimsuits on Foundry maps or bridges please! I would pay zen for that.
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 451
# 52
12-23-2013, 08:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpalelena View Post
Its a battlecruiser with singularity abilities instead of cruiser commands.

And how it performs against a Scimitar, depends on the Scimitar variant.

Because it can out-tank all but the Falchion.
The fleet version can defiantly out tank the Falchion, cmd engi and lt cmdr tac and science..


But the D'deridex can increase its turn a lot just battle cloak ?

Last edited by cryptkeeper0; 12-23-2013 at 08:49 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 706
# 53
12-23-2013, 08:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by eisenw0lf View Post
I completely agree with you, but this is just not how STO mechanics work. There is always this one build which far exceeds all other options. The sad thing about the D'D is that it would only need ONE more Lt Eng station and you'd see it everywhere in PvP. Even if it would loose its LtC Sci station in exchange for that it would be so much more powerful in comparison. But since this is not the case it remains a pure vanity PvE ship, just like the Fed Galaxy.
People always give up on something that isn't familiar to them. The d'd and galaxy are both capable of being just as powerful as any other ship in the game. But it takes a truly dedicated person with a real passion for either one to make it possible. I've found the galaxy to be an extremely worthy and worthwhile ship, but after many months of research and trial and error. Just because setup A works for 1 ship, doesn't mean its going to work on another ship that's similar to it. If it weren't for the fact that I'd have to create an entirely new character and start from scratch, I'd set out to find a forbidable build for the dkd just as I did for the galaxy.
Commander
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 412
# 54
12-23-2013, 08:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by skollulfr View Post
yes op, the dd is not a cruiser.
its a capital warship, maybe even verging on super-capital.

issue here is cryptic pulling turnrates out of the ether, leading to things like the scimitar & hafeh.

its not like its even as small an issue as explaining the difference in agility between a prometheus & dacota.
I agree this is a problem. My Fleet Heavy Cruiser is about the same size as an Advanced Escort yet has a much lower turn rate. The Scimitar is one of the largest playable ships in the game and has a turn rate of 7. That's the same as the Fleet Assault Cruiser which is about the size of one of the Scimitars wings.

The D'Deridex's turn rate is also kind of a joke in that it is based on a line from the TNG Episode "Tin Man" when someone on the bridge of the Enterprise said the the DD was slower then the Enterprise. If you watch the episode they are referring to maximum warp speed and NOT maneuverability. I'm betting this is what the Cryptic dev team based their misguided decision on and how we ended up with a DD with the pitiable turn rate of 5... cause it has to be less the the Galaxy which is currently sitting at a very peppy 6.


U.S.S. Mary Celeste
Commander
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 412
# 55
12-23-2013, 09:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghyudt View Post
People always give up on something that isn't familiar to them. The d'd and galaxy are both capable of being just as powerful as any other ship in the game. But it takes a truly dedicated person with a real passion for either one to make it possible. I've found the galaxy to be an extremely worthy and worthwhile ship, but after many months of research and trial and error. Just because setup A works for 1 ship, doesn't mean its going to work on another ship that's similar to it. If it weren't for the fact that I'd have to create an entirely new character and start from scratch, I'd set out to find a forbidable build for the dkd just as I did for the galaxy.
The problem with the Galaxy is that any build that you come up with that you think is good can be slapped on one of the other available federation cruisers and will perform better. The Fleet Assault Cruiser, Fleet Advanced Heavy Cruiser, and Fleet Battle Cruiser will all do more damage and the Fleet Support Cruiser and Odyssey are better support ships and can also deal more damage.

I have the fleet versions of all the Federation cruisers, including the Fleet Exploration Cruiser and as much as I loved TNG and the Enterprise D (Probably my favorite ship). It is, unfortunately, the worst cruiser in the game.

At least the DD is usable, even with its low turn rate, it has a LtCmd Sci and Tac stations and a more balanced console layout.


U.S.S. Mary Celeste
Captain
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,169
# 56
12-23-2013, 09:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikephorus View Post
The D'Deridex's turn rate is also kind of a joke in that it is based on a line from the TNG Episode "Tin Man" when someone on the bridge of the Enterprise said the the DD was slower then the Enterprise. If you watch the episode they are referring to maximum warp speed and NOT maneuverability. I'm betting this is what the Cryptic dev team based their misguided decision on and how we ended up with a DD with the pitiable turn rate of 5... cause it has to be less the the Galaxy which is currently sitting at a very peppy 6.
Cryptic balances turn-rate to hit-points. The D'D has a lot of hit-points, so it has a slow turn-rate. Other factors like model size are secondary.

Scim is a broken overpowered cash-grab design with no place in the game and should not be used as a reference to anything.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,559
# 57
12-23-2013, 10:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ursusmorologus View Post
Cryptic balances turn-rate to hit-points. The D'D has a lot of hit-points, so it has a slow turn-rate. Other factors like model size are secondary.

Scim is a broken overpowered cash-grab design with no place in the game and should not be used as a reference to anything.
Broken with its whopping 2 eng slots? That ship is a glass cannon.
Let us wear Swimsuits on Foundry maps or bridges please! I would pay zen for that.
Commander
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 412
# 58
12-23-2013, 11:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ursusmorologus View Post
Cryptic balances turn-rate to hit-points. The D'D has a lot of hit-points, so it has a slow turn-rate. Other factors like model size are secondary.

Scim is a broken overpowered cash-grab design with no place in the game and should not be used as a reference to anything.
Well it's in the game so it will be referenced and be used as a comparison for other ships in the game. Though I do agree with you that its an overpowered cash-grab. I remember the day it was released... Scimitars exploding everywhere. With pilots shouting; "My I win button doesn't work!"


U.S.S. Mary Celeste
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,141
# 59
12-23-2013, 12:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpalelena View Post
Broken with its whopping 2 eng slots? That ship is a glass cannon.
It doesn't need it. Coming out of cloaks, the Scimitar has the firepower to melt everything before the decloak damage buff is done.

+25% Warbird Decloak Damage Bonus.
+ Superior Infiltrator to raise decloak damage buff duration to 15 seconds instead of the usual 5. Which is enough time for 1 full use of Emergency Power to Weapons and 1 cycle of TAC BOFF attacks.
+ Superior Operative to increase CritH & Crit Severity AND lessen Battle Cloak cooldowns.
+ Superior Subterfuge to increase decloak damage buff to 30%.

And that's generic, overall Romulan BOFF stuff that can be attained, some from Embassy. And that's before we get to the Scimitar itself.

Weapons 5 Fwd/3 Aft (more to melt things in front)
- 5 TAC Consoles
- Cmdr TAC station
- Benefits of Scimitar Consoles, whether you do some or all of them.
- "Valdore" Console if you have it, where you have a chance to heal shields by shooting more.

Combine all that and you have an offensive powerhouse. Forward firepower with the BOFF station support and Console space to make it hurt. The fixed TAC BOFF station is enough to get you good attacks to last from one attack run coming out of cloaks and going back into cloak. You will max out the damage bonuses weaving in and out of this. I've helped utility and survivability by using the LtCdr Universal as ENG. Going this route, I suddenly have a very hefty LtCdr and Lt ENG BOFF setup, with enough space for Lt SCI (fixed) and an Universal Ensign to go anywhere. It may have only 2 ENG Consoles, but with a hefty ENG BOFF setup, it's survivable enough, and I don't even use EPTS with it... I go EPTW3 to really feed the weapons systems with firepower and damage boost.

The Scimitar Consoles also give options for a survivability.

The Scimitar is Cannon, but it's not quite a Glass one.

Edit to add: I've been seeing guys using the Scimitar as a Beamboat and succeeding, negating to a degree the somewhat slower turn rate of the ship. This helps survivability because the Scimitar can move faster and not be forced to keep facing the target as if using DHCs/DCs/DBBs/Torps.

Cryptic's Development Philosophy for the KDF & PVP

Last edited by warmaker001b; 12-23-2013 at 12:10 PM.
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