Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,808
# 1 Karfi Build Assistance
10-28-2013, 11:26 PM
Pulling an old engineering character out of semi-retirement for S8 (and PVE stuff in general). My first KDF character and never respeced in 20 months of play, so her old layout is quite newbie and she's getting a full clean-slate rebuild. I was looking at doing a Kar'fi, tinkering with a few ideas and I ended up with kind of an odd hybrid of FAW-boat plus Support Cruiser plus Frigates. It looks interesting to me, but I've never been able to get my Kar'fi attempts to work quite right, always adequate but never 'this rocks!' Therefore thought I'd get some additional opinions.

IKS Gorrath

Notes and Questions:
Doffs would be 2 damage control, gravimetric sci, and tractor beam. Not sure what to put in the 5th, maybe another damage control or a blue warp-core-cleanse (purple out of my price range).

Anything with Fleet or Nukara in the name I don't actually own yet, this is all hypothetical so haven't dropped any dil just yet (and grinding out 1000 nukara marks isn't my idea of fun unless I'm certain).

Never really tried playing with any kind of mines in any significant capacity before, but the more I tinkered the more the Nukara Web Mines just seemed to 'fit.' I know they're much-hated in PVP, but can something as slow as a Karfi get much use out of them in PVE, or does that require nimbler maneuvering?

I went with tetryon as I started tinkering with Nukara stuff figuring 'why not?' and with how unpopular they are I can buy a higher grade of tac console for the same price, giving me more bang for my buck. Plus with the extra flow capacitors, the tetryon glider, and the doffed tractor beam, it might turn into a real shield-eater for my pets to exploit. Thats the theory anyways.

The Omega set is for the accuracy, the glider, the speed, and honestly because the Karfi's exhaust trail bugs me. I could alternate with Borg 11 deflector/engine for extra durability, or KHG 12 for extra aux energy and sci boosts, but I think that with my eng captain abilities and running high aux, I should be okay emphasizing offense. Maybe.

The Field Generator in the sci consoles is kind of a placeholder, a spot saved for mission specific gear like if I want to swap in an Aceton Assimilator or a Graviton Pulse Generator or whatever, and otherwise just fill the slot with extra shield capacity when nothing else is needed. So its out-of-place on purpose.

For the Fer'jai frigates, I'm just using the stock ones right now. Looking at the STO Wiki, it looks like the only difference between the Advanced and Elite is the rating of the CRF/THY? There anything else different between the two?

And one last one for people to chuckle at my indecisiveness. On my Omega rep I just can't decide what T4 passive to pick, the boosted shield regen or the hull damage proc, for a PVE carrier specialist.

This is all still in the planning stages. It looks okay to me, but I also have this feeling I'm missing something. Thoughts?

Last edited by reginamala78; 10-29-2013 at 01:27 AM.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,797
# 2
10-29-2013, 06:25 AM
I own a Karfi as well but never really seriuosly used it. I am curiuos to see what advice you get as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by staq16 View Post
The Federation may have all the superficial attention - but the game engine has a Klingon heart that lives only for battle.
Captain
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 574
# 3
10-29-2013, 08:10 AM
I have a tendency in matters like this to "equip to theme," e.g. my Orion flight-deck cruiser only uses the Orion hangar pets. Are the Kar'fi dedicated pets well-regarded? Is one (fighter or frigate) markedly better? In a 2-hangar carrier, should one stick with two of the same type, or can 1+1 work?

Gen
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 141
# 4
10-29-2013, 09:17 AM
Well both of my KDF chars (quite old... have the accolade for making LTG before whatever date that was) fly Karfis in near-identical builds. (one ENG, one SCI)

I use 4x DBBs/3xTurrets... this allows me to keep some damage on my target all the time (which you should do as a carrier pilot, as your pets will attack near all the time as well). With Fire At Will, your DBBs can focus down on a target quite nicely.

I use Tac Team (with 2xTac Team accelerator DOFFs for near-100% uptime of my Tac Team). This is probably the most important thing for KarFi pilots, as you have really good shields but weak hull and few engineering slots. For the rest of my Tac I use BFAW3/BFAW1, and 2xAPB/D (tbh i think that my engineer uses one of each and my sci uses 2 deltas).

For ENG skills, you only have 2. I strongly recommend EP2Shields and AUX2SIF.

Sci you have some flexibility. IIRC I use 2x Tractor Beams, TSS2, HE3, and GW3

DOFFs: as above, 2x Tac Team DOFFs is manditory. Beyond that... I think I have a tractor doff to add a bit of shield drain to the 2 tractor beams. Not sure what the last 2 are... next time I'm IG I'll check and post here.

Equipment? 3x 30% damage consoles (I use plasma here and Rom Plasma weapons from the Rep store... carrier pilots really benefit from a disruptor proc to eliminate 10% resistance for your pets. Karfi doubly so, as you want really big number from your pet's tricobalts)
For sci consoles I think I have the usual: borg/rom/leech/rom +damage +flow cap console.
Eng? I think 1x nanodium and 1x TCC from the lobi store.

For equipment I use the MACO (err... adapted KHG) shields and omega engines/deflector for tetryon glider.

I have elite Frigs and they are really good. I mean really good. Lots of BIG numbers in elite STFs... which this ship does fantastic in. Also 4x aceton beams from the frigs shut down the borg bosses easily and help your team's survivability.

Oh and of course your antimatter warp core should add +5 weapon energy and stuff. For more DPS.
Commander
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 367
# 5
10-29-2013, 10:28 AM
I used a Kar'fi in PvE for a long time on my sci. With a bit of practice, you can make Dual Heavy Cannons work on it quite well, and that ship - a locomotive had a baby with a karp? - has the tac slots to make use of them.
Julius - Klingon Tactical Officer, B'rel Bird of Prey // Rujan - Klingon Science Officer, Temporal Science Vessel
Marcellus - Romulan Tactical Officer, Scimitar Warbird // Aurelius - Klingon Science Officer, B'rel Bird of Prey
Hadrian, Romulan Tactical Officer, Fleet T'varo Retrofit
Lieutenant
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 41
# 6
10-29-2013, 11:47 AM
I play a lot of ESTF/PUG, so most of my layout is geared towards supporting/attacking within that situation/battle. I do not play PvP (just not my cup of tea) and it is general a usable build.


I use Antiproton beams (4 x [CrtH] [Dmg]x2] + 1 x [CrtD]x2[Dmg] + 1 x [Acc][CrtH][Dmg]) and fill the tactical consoles with Antiproton Mags (to boost the beam damage).

The advanced Fer?Jai Frigate adds to the damage with and comes with a nice set of abilities and weapons: Dual antiproton cannons + antiproton turret, Chroniton & Tricobalt Torpedos Tricobalt Mines. For the abilities Cannon: Rapid Fire II, Torpedo: High Yield II and Aceton Beam I.

The Quantum torpedo is not used as much, as I am spending most of the time broadsiding, so it is a bit of an effect to face nearly forward to launch it ? to me it does not feel very Star Trek without firing a few off (with high yield)!

I use the Honor Guard set to give me a nice boost (to name a few):
+18 Starship Structural Integrity (helps with the low hull)
+18 Starship Graviton Generators and +18 Starship Particle Generator (helps with the gravity well)
+3.8 Weapon, Shield and Auxiliary power (nice bonus to the power systems)
+7 additional Auxiliary power (this further helps with the science abilities ? we are +10.8 Aux)
+25% Bonus to Torpedo Damage (give my torpedo 25% additional damage, like having a tactical console)
With my current layout (and the honor guard shield) I have managed to achieve ~10,000 capacity.

The Graviton & Particle Generator science consoles add additional boosts to my gravity well, this goes nicely with the above (honor guard set)

The Assimilated Module (console) gives me the following:
+0.92% Critical Chance and +9.2% Critical Severity (helps with the Antiproton weapons)
+5 Weapon Power Setting (another boost to weapon power)
+5.1 Starship Hull Repair (helps with the low hull)
+23 Starship Graviton Generators (helps with the gravity well)

The Zero-Point Energy Conduit (console) gives me the following (key ones for me):
+1.8 Power to all subsystems (more power to all subsystems!)
+1.8% Critical Chance (helps with the Antiproton weapons)

I use the overcharged warp to put (yet) more power into the auxiliary system (which helps with the science abilities in general)

I have +100 weapon, +50 shields and 25 to engine/aux, my weapon reaches ~125+ and with the above power bonus have ~65+ shield power and ~40+ engine/aux (can?t remember the exact figures).

Have a look at the following link for the above details and bridge officer abilities ? I think they are logical. ? Most are to keep me or my allies alive, hit multiple targets, and focus damage on a single target and crowd control.

(Sorry about the long wall text ... take what is useful and remember to have fun it your build and do what you like!)


Edited: Was in a rush, updated with a full description in case anyone looks at this post for ideas

Last edited by rocmist; 10-29-2013 at 04:43 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,260
# 7
10-29-2013, 04:34 PM
For the OPs build:
Shields:
I highly recommend Resilient Shields for the Kar'fi. The Kar'fi's low hull (escort class nowadays) needs the protection of only 5% bleedthrough, but the 1.2 shield mod allows for enough capacity and regen on Resilient Shields that the lower capacity of them isn't a big hindrance. I'm using Elite Fleet Resilient Shields on mine to great effect, and the Adapted KHG I was using before that did much better than standard KHG Mk XII on the Kar'fi. Note: If you use the Adapted KHG shields along with Plasmonic Leech, there is sometimes weird bouncing between power levels as you get hit and are shooting at the same time, thanks to the two procs replacing each other instead of stacking.

Deflector/engines:
I usually go with KHG on it, which has a nice blend of Science stuff and a bit of Structural Integrity for more hull HP on the Deflector, then a bunch of Efficient power bonuses on the engines, with +8.8 Aux and 25% torp damage on top for a two-piece. I don't think any set will really save you from having to hit Miracle Worker if you draw a large amount of aggro, though.

Consoles:
I'd move the Plasmonic Leech down to Sci, and then either add an RCS with [ResAll] for more speed, or a Neutronium with [HullHP] for more survivability. You might consider [HuH] or [SuH] on one or both of your Embassy Flow Caps, as a hull heal proc would be good since you have a general lack of hull heal on your BOffs, and I've found the Shield Heal proc nice to plug holes in Sci ship shields when stuff is on cooldown (though, shield heals should be less of an issue on your EPtW/S cycle build and you being an engineer RSF.)

BOff and DOff layout:
As I mentioned above, you have a lack of hull heals beyond a single HE and your MW as a Eng captain. Going with another HE somewhere would be a very good idea to heal up non-critical hull damage or if MW is on cooldown.

The EPtW and EPtS with DCEs is an idea I was considering myself as you can get very high up-times on both with 3x purple DCEs, and with EPS Manifold Efficiency (Engineering Trait) your power levels should be pretty nice.

Right now, I'm using one EPtS with 3x purple DCEs, and one Aux2SIF for the resists and hull heal at a nice fast pace, since I'm using it on a Tac and don't have MW to back me up. The main problem is that EPtS cooldown via the DCEs can fail at bad times. With 2x different EPt abilities the chance of proc'ing the DCEs is double, and even the 2x blue DCEs on my Avenger Fed side proc decently reliably.

For the suggestion of running Conn Officers for the Tac Team cooldown and Attack Patterns buff, I'd consider it critical for Tac captains as it means a large buff for APA and any patterns in BOffs, but I'm not sure it'd be that worthwhile for an Eng with only one APB. It does give the option of loading up another Ensign Tac power in a platform low on those, and I use my spare spot for a torp spread.

Pets:
Fer'jai hangars are very nice, particularly with the star ranking system giving advantages to higher HP pets. I'm not sure if there is any difference between the Advanced and Elite other than ability ranks, but rank 3 abilities should be able to fire off faster which would give an advantage worthwhile for just that, with extra damage being icing on the cake. I have a wing of Advanced Fer'jai on mine , quite nice, particularly if you can pick up the Wing Commander Trait off the Exchange, I need to upgrade them to Elite at some point, and pick up something better than Advanced Slavers for the other side.

Passives:
Grab boosted shield regen on Omega as shields are life for the Kar'fi.
Captain
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,181
# 8
10-29-2013, 08:52 PM
Kar'Fi Battle Carrier

Commander Science: Hazard Emitters I , Transfer Shield Strength II , Energy Siphon II , Energy Siphon III

Lt. Commander Tactical: Tactical Team I , Cannon Scatter Volley I , Torpedo Spread III

Lieutenant Tactical: Tactical Team I , Cannon Rapid Fire I

Lieutenant Engineer: Emergency Power to Shields I , Auxiliary to Structural Integrity I

Ensign Science: Polarized Hull I

Thanks to High Aux Power I had with help from a Warp Core that increased Aux Power based on my Weapons power and using 2 Energy Siphon powers I was able to have high Power levels constantly.

I used it in PvE and was doing fine but in Ker'rat I was having trouble staying alive from being attacked by multiple people. It requires a lot of expense for hangers and duty officers to get the Kar'Fi Battle Carrier to be great and I was not wanting to go to that expensive yet so I switched to Kamarag Battlecruiser Retrofit and have done a lot better with it using Aux to Battery (with free Technician Duty officers from B'Tran) build especially now with Cruiser Commanders.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,808
# 9
10-30-2013, 12:11 AM
Thanks for the thoughts so far.

My current setup, I run single cannons and turrets plus a torp, and it works fine on all the stationary and slow targets in ESTFs and the like, but on a ship that turns that slowly I just don't like how it feels, having to play the forward-reverse yoyo game because I can't turn quickly enough to make passes (maybe some people can pilot it that way, I can't). And thats with SINGLE cannons and their wide arc no less. Plus for slow, tough, and DHCs, I already have a separate tac in a Tor'kaht. So for those reasons, I'm definitely going to use 6 BAs as my primary offense, stay mobile and broadside like a tac-heavy cruiser (and definately not plasma- or disruptor-based; I've already done that several ways). Its just a matter of weapon #7 and setting my tac slots accordingly. I could go with mines like in my OP, nukara or tractor, but not sure how the speed would work out. I could use a KCB and add the Assimilated Module, then set my tac slots to APB2/APB1/FAW2/FAW1, but that seems kinda bland for a ship as unique as the Kar'fi. Could simply add a torpedo and add Spread 2, but with the broadsiding wouldn't see much use (wish there was a wide-angle torp KDF side). So yeah, following that logic is how I ended up with my posted potential setup, but I'm not dead-set on it so much as set on a couple things I'm trying to avoid because I've already done elsewhere.

Shields, I did think about the Covariant vs Resilient debate and the Kar'fi's thinner hull and my limited hull heals. I picked Covariant to get the most out of the shield modifier though, but that said I've been doing a couple runs with a Resilient and keeping an eye on my hull, seeing how noticeable a difference it makes.

The hull heal ability on fleet sci consoles is something I've never really looked at. What exactly does it do, just boost passive regeneration or a hull-heal proc like the Borg 2-piece. How much does it add?

The paired EPTx abilities with DCEs, its something already on my current build as well as several other ships, and something I know works. By having two abilities for the DCEs to check against, I get 4 (and potentially 6) proc chances per cycle, giving me two always-on abilities and a gap of only 1.5 seconds in my EPTS hardening. Much as I'd love to throw an Aux2SIF in there (particularly running decent aux), the extra 2(3) proc chances and 30 extra system energy is just too good to pass up. Not that I haven't thought about it.

Omega vs KHG vs Borg I think is largely gonna depend on the rest of my final setup. Fortunately I already have all 3 sets from pre-Reputation days, so I can swap at will. We'll just put the rest together then see what fits the best. Yay for hoarding.

As I said, thanks for the replies so far.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,260
# 10
10-30-2013, 09:57 AM
I've had to stack up a Mk XII RCS, Neutronium[Turn], a Tachyokinetic Converter and a Warp Core that gave a bonus to engine power (just a Hyper core w/Efficient one was good enough, then I went with W->A for more Aux) to get my turnrate to where I liked it decently. I don't really do 'passes' in STFs, as the fighter metaphor never really made sense to me, when something more like helicopter tactics work as good or better. However, I can keep up with with the changing group locations of Fleet Alerts and Tau Dewa patrols with little trouble, though, no where near as fast as an escort/raptor.

I wish Cryptic would come out with more heavy single cannons, as right now the only one is the Elachi Crescent Cannon, which you can only mount one of and costs 200 Lobi. It is nice, particularly with CSV.

The Heal on Embassy consoles is a proc like the Borg set. It's big enough that the proc is noticeable on a Fleet Tor'kaht. I haven't actually mounted a hull-heal one on a Kar'fi, as I was more worried about shields than anything. IIRC, it is a large heal-over-time with a red circle coming from your hull as its animation.
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