Career Officer
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 579
# 31
11-12-2013, 08:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mandoknight89 View Post
Obviously, they decided that the atrocious thighs on most skirts was a current/long time bug and worth working on.
Well, to be fair, the female legs looked awfully originally, if the character wore a skirt, judging by the screenshots. I wouldn't know, because I'd not have my character wear dress/skirt if they paid me for it, but I can see why people would get upset, if they wanted to have an option for skirts, and when picking them, they were stuck with horribly looking legs... So I am glad they are trying to address the issue.

Some people find it difficult to understand that other people are concerned about seemingly 'trivial' things about their characters, which technically have nothing to do with game mechanics/gameplay improvement; but I understand completelly. People love to immerse into the game and create characters they like, in order to increase the enjoyment and immersion in the game.

~jodarkrider's female torso improvements suggestions~
Twitter - @JanDarkrider (mostly RP & self-parody in character)
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,879
# 32
11-12-2013, 09:21 PM
Oh, thighs looked badly wrong on most skirts before. They were perfectly fine on the nurse skirt / split skirt and the others could have been adjusted to match that, and everyone would have been happy.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,976
# 33
11-13-2013, 02:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crypticjoejing View Post
Now in S8, the legs with skirts look more natural by default. However, this introduced a new bug where the waist is clipping. Do we freak out and revert? Only if the new bug is worse than the previous problem and/or is too difficult to fix. In this case, the seam is an easy fix, so we should keep the improved legs and fix the new bug.
Let me open by saying thank you for your continued discussion on this subject, it is very much appreciated.

I can't say I've seen the skirt clipping myself but I can imagine it would be quite the problem for players. I can live with the new model work, it's nice to have someone looking into the possibility of improving the old stuff, but could you look into how legs with a skirt in the "cute" stance don't reflect what you choose in the character creator please?

So far as I can see the legs in the creator look fine (some might say great) but what that produces on the game model is an acceptable thigh size but the calf is practically non-existent which fora Starfleet officer shouldn't really be possible what with all the running and stuff (it's also horrible disproportionate to the rest of the body with the slider settings shown here)

I don't know if it holds true for other stances (it seems "standard" doesn't suffer, or at least not as much) but if possible I don't want to change my character's stance as this is a considerable amount of work myself to brush up my character's form to suit her new stance

Again, thanks for the continued support, hopefully we'll all get this fixed soon
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 96
# 34
11-13-2013, 03:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by futurepastnow View Post
Oh, thighs looked badly wrong on most skirts before. They were perfectly fine on the nurse skirt / split skirt and the others could have been adjusted to match that, and everyone would have been happy.
Yeah, pretty much. I know I was amongst other posters suggesting this.
------------------------------------------------

"Back on topic. Destinii is correct."

(Formerly Destinii until the 'Great PWE Forum Shakeup of 2012')
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,879
# 35
11-13-2013, 06:53 AM
I'm sorry, crypticjoejing. As an artist, the desire to make things better must be tremendous. And a noble goal. But what's "better" is totally subjective, and apart from some specific complaints, it looks like most of us were relatively happy before.

Thanks for taking the time to communicate with us. It's a refreshing change from the total silence we've had from the character art team for 3+ years. This forum can be rough.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,738
# 36
11-13-2013, 07:38 AM
in a skirt the Thigh's are still too skinny even at maxium

what we had before was much better than this my new romulan looks like a anorexic model

a 2x4 can pass thru the gap and not touch any skin !!!!!!! Thats So WRONG

Thank god my main toons are saved
Jellico....Engineer.....Stargazer KDF Tac
Saphire.. Science.....Ko'el Rom Kdf Tac
Leva........Tactical.....Mailu KDF Sci

JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,664
# 37
11-13-2013, 08:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamkafei View Post
I got as close as I'm likely to get to these criteria and the results can be found here:
https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=1d51a...18C36C7%211036

And while these look more similar I shouldn't be forced to change my character's look to suit a new pose just so she looks remotely Human (or Betazoid in her case)
I'm still not convinced that what you're seeing is not the result of camera angle and distance. If the character model used in the tailor is actually different from the one used outside the tailor, then that is a pretty serious bug. It is difficult for users to get the same camera position inside and outside of the tailor. Maybe, someone at Cryptic with better tools than us can actually test this.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,976
# 38
11-13-2013, 08:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by frtoaster View Post
I'm still not convinced that what you're seeing is not the result of camera angle and distance. If the character model used in the tailor is actually different from the one used outside the tailor, then that is a pretty serious bug. It is difficult for users to get the same camera position inside and outside of the tailor. Maybe, someone at Cryptic with better tools than us can actually test this.
I agree that it is difficult, I got as close as possible in the game as possible to the tailor zoom level while managing to keep entire character on the screen (as the tailor does). Heck I'm not sure if it is possible to achieve the exact same viewpoint and zoom level in both the game and the tailor.

Equally I'm not sure if it's a different model or just different scaling but looking at the pictures here there is definitely something different/not translating properly in the given stance so that might factor in as well...

EDIT: Did some additional playing and I think it's a scaling issue I have here, see pics below, I'm sure I'm seeing a difference between the results...

Minimun

Maximum

Again I've done my best to match camera locations, is it just me or does the tailor go both higher and lower than the game?

Last edited by adamkafei; 11-13-2013 at 09:37 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,664
# 39
11-13-2013, 10:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamkafei View Post
I agree that it is difficult, I got as close as possible in the game as possible to the tailor zoom level while managing to keep entire character on the screen (as the tailor does). Heck I'm not sure if it is possible to achieve the exact same viewpoint and zoom level in both the game and the tailor.

Equally I'm not sure if it's a different model or just different scaling but looking at the pictures here there is definitely something different/not translating properly in the given stance so that might factor in as well...

EDIT: Did some additional playing and I think it's a scaling issue I have here, see pics below, I'm sure I'm seeing a difference between the results...

Minimun

Maximum

Again I've done my best to match camera locations, is it just me or does the tailor go both higher and lower than the game?
I kind of see what you mean now. It is possible that the slider settings have different scales inside and outside of the tailor.

There is also something weird in those screenshots you took at maximum leg bulk from the right side. There is a bulge in the back of the thigh just above the knee. That was a problem seen in earlier Tribble builds with the "Feminine" and "Cute" stances. (It can only be seen with bent knees.) I thought they had fixed that problem though.
Cryptic Studios Team
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 119
# 40
11-13-2013, 10:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cerritourug View Post
I picture is better than 1000 words:
Old Holodeck leg model:
http://i1189.photobucket.com/albums/...3-20-56-11.jpg

Current Holodeck leg model:
http://i1189.photobucket.com/albums/...3-20-57-11.jpg

The current one is not perfect (expecialy the hip width that is going to be fixed) but the legs are much better NOW.

Lets wait that crypticjoejing gives us the fix, and then we decide if we want to go back to thouse horrible legs.

Sorry for bad english.
Thanks for that example, cerritourug!

Perfect answer for all the repeated questions about why we're "fixing something that isn't broken" - *that* is exactly what we were trying to improve. And we did. But there are many interconnected elements to do this and you guys are seeing some of the arguably mild side effects (that we will be addressing).

As always, your feedback helps us catch all of the negative side effects and we do watch the forums (again, even if the devs don't respond often - we're usually working ).
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