Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
01-31-2010, 05:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumoben View Post
If I did, my name would be in yellow.. I think you're missing a common sense chip somewhere.

And honestly, Retail Launches for games are big most of the time because people are going out to pick up their pre-orders... Not new purchase commitments.

Also, its usually for games that open their servers on release day, without a headstart period.
"common sense" is an oxymoron.

At any rate, there will be an increase, but likely not by a great amount. Most people interested in playing have preordered, but quite a few have not. I for one do not typically preorder things unless there is some sort of benefit to doing such. In this case I was able to get exclusive items, access to beta, and access to the head start. I got something extra that I otherwise wouldn't have had I waited until after launch, and I for zero difference in price.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
01-31-2010, 05:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lefty1117 View Post
5 years ago I would have agreed with this, but there was no competition there. People had either WoW or SWG. SWG was already out a few months and was already hemmoraghing subscriptions.

Now, people have other options, including Old Faithful - WoW. There will not be as much patience. ***, TR, WAR, and Cryptic's own CO can attest to that. If you don't get it right on your first try, you may not get another.
But don't discount the power of the Star Trek name. People were willing to wait through the Perpetual fiasco and we are willing to wait until Cryptic fixes the bugs and things. Sure, there are those complainers out there, but thats normal for any game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaedalEVE View Post
"common sense" is an oxymoron.

At any rate, there will be an increase, but likely not by a great amount. Most people interested in playing have preordered, but quite a few have not. I for one do not typically preorder things unless there is some sort of benefit to doing such. In this case I was able to get exclusive items, access to beta, and access to the head start. I got something extra that I otherwise wouldn't have had I waited until after launch, and I for zero difference in price.
See, what people don't notice is that I never mentioned that I didn't agree with the fact that Retail launch was going to add more people..

I only said that after the grace period is over, that there will be less people.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
01-31-2010, 05:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lefty1117 View Post
5 years ago I would have agreed with this, but there was no competition there. People had either WoW or SWG. SWG was already out a few months and was already hemmoraghing subscriptions.

Now, people have other options, including Old Faithful - WoW. There will not be as much patience. ***, TR, WAR, and Cryptic's own CO can attest to that. If you don't get it right on your first try, you may not get another.
This. Game designers can't look back to old models of MMO game launches in a much more competitive market and not expect to be seriously burned by underperforming. Competition is fierce, and while an IP with name recognition may earn you more initial looks, it won't necessarily keep those people and has the flipside of actually increasing expectations in some cases. Star Trek populatrity is a two edged sword.

Because of this, I never recommend anybody ever but NEVER buy a lifetime subscription to anything until it is established as successful and stable. I admit I broke my own rule here somewhat, by preordering a game that was not established as ready for launch. My bad.

STO...Let the Buyer Beware.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
01-31-2010, 05:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumoben View Post
I expect to see less after the grace period, but after Cryptic fixes majority of the bugs, and adds more content, and the game truly kicks off..
It will be too late...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
01-31-2010, 05:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumoben View Post
But don't discount the power of the Star Trek name. People were willing to wait through the Perpetual fiasco and we are willing to wait until Cryptic fixes the bugs and things. Sure, there are those complainers out there, but thats normal for any game.



See, what people don't notice is that I never mentioned that I didn't agree with the fact that Retail launch was going to add more people..

I only said that after the grace period is over, that there will be less people.
Yeah, and we also could have waited a couple more months for them to work out the bugs and other issues before releasing as well. That's what people are complaining about. Not because they are *******s, they don;t like you, or they want to be jerks. It's because they know you need to fix the stuff NOW. Launching half ass is a sure fire way to fail. I for one don't want failure here, but I refuse to wear rose colored glasses and see things any other way than they actually are.

Everyone who's going around now saying that "all this is normal", "everyone needs to chill and wait", are just like all those who said the economy was fine two years ago, "there was nothing to worry about" they said.
Well, look around.... see what denial gets you.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
01-31-2010, 05:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HunterPDX View Post
This. Game designers can't look back to old models of MMO game launches in a much more competitive market and not expect to be seriously burned by underperforming. Competition is fierce, and while an IP with name recognition may earn you more initial looks, it won't necessarily keep those people and has the flipside of actually increasing expectations in some cases. Star Trek populatrity is a two edged sword.

Because of this, I never recommend anybody ever but NEVER buy a lifetime subscription to anything until it is established as successful and stable. I admit I broke my own rule here somewhat, by preordering a game that was not established as ready for launch. My bad.

STO...Let the Buyer Beware.
However unfortunate, I can't say this enough...

Cryptic started with a staff of 40 for STO.

Now, if they had half the staff or money of Blizzard.. Imagine what they could have done with the time they had. (After the successes of WC to WCIII and the Diablo and Starcraft series of games, they had plenty of money to work with.)

Now, as they get more money from subs/retail sales, hopefully they'll be able to increase their staff, and be able to churn out updates like its nobody's business. Its unfortunate that in today's world that everyone's head is so far into the concept of instant gratification that they have no sense of patience anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaedalEVE View Post
Yeah, and we also could have waited a couple more months for them to work out the bugs and other issues before releasing as well. That's what people are complaining. Not because they are *******s, they don;t like you, or they want to be jerks. It's because they know you need to fix the stuff NOW. Launching half ass is a sure fire way to fail. I for one don't want failure here, but I refuse to wear rose colored glasses and see things any other way than they actually are.

Everyone who's going around now saying that "all this is normal", "everyone needs to chill and wait", are just like all those who said the economy was fine two years ago, "there was nothing to worry about" they said.
Well, look around.... see what denial gets you.
There would have been even MORE complaints if they delayed the release of the game... And there would have been zero chance of recovery from that, even with the Star Trek name behind it.

And no, I'm not looking at it through rose colored glasses, or being in denial. Its about having faith in Cryptic, and being optimistic.

They knew the economy wasn't fine two years ago. Politics is all about subterfuge. They can say its fine, even though in reality its not, But if they started doing something about it, then people would know that something really was wrong.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
01-31-2010, 05:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumoben View Post
However unfortunate, I can't say this enough...

Cryptic started with a staff of 40 for STO.

Now, if they had half the staff or money of Blizzard.. Imagine what they could have done with the time they had. (After the successes of WC to WCIII and the Diablo and Starcraft series of games, they had plenty of money to work with.)

Now, as they get more money from subs/retail sales, hopefully they'll be able to increase their staff, and be able to churn out updates like its nobody's business. Its unfortunate that in today's world that everyone's head is so far into the concept of instant gratification that they have no sense of patience anymore.
The ones who needed patience where the EXECUTIVES at cryptic and atari, who decided to launch too early. End of argument.

Oh and realize that cryptic will first have to make back it's investment capital before it makes any profit, and will have to turn a profit before they can expand. You are talking several months of waiting until that point is reached.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
01-31-2010, 05:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaedalEVE View Post
The ones who needed patience where the EXECUTIVES at cryptic and atari, who decided to launch too early. End of argument.
Thanks for making my point about people not having patience anymore for me, I appreciate it.

They weren't impatient about it, they knew that if they delayed, that there would have been no chance of recovery. At least now, they have a chance to fix it. Unfortunately, people are impatient and don't want to wait a little while. This isn't life or death. You aren't going to die just because the game isn't playing like you want it to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaedalEVE View Post
Oh and realize that cryptic will first have to make back it's investment capital before it makes any profit, and will have to turn a profit before they can expand. You are talking several months of waiting until that point is reached.
Cryptic isn't a brand new start-up company.. If it was, then i'd be more worried about something like this.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
01-31-2010, 06:01 PM
I think we won't see a surge until next Friday-Saturday. The majority of people who want to play this game will have pre-ordered and have been playing the head start (part of the reason I find it so funny people are angry they aren't getting exp bonuses for downtime - they're only really competing against each other in the race to the top).

People will see the game in the shops over the week from Tuesday to Friday and probably pick it up to play on the weekend.

I think Tuesday-Thursday *****ing will involve pre-order bonuses not working properly. Should be entertaining.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
01-31-2010, 06:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumoben View Post
Thanks for making my point about people not having patience anymore for me, I appreciate it.

They weren't impatient about it, they knew that if they delayed, that there would have been no chance of recovery. At least now, they have a chance to fix it. Unfortunately, people are impatient and don't want to wait a little while. This isn't life or death. You aren't going to die just because the game isn't playing like you want it to.
Exactly HOW did my prior comment prove your point?
No seriously, explain yourself... because I fail to see how anything I said show "impatience".

If anything, my comment pointed out that I think launch needs to be pushed back, which suggests I prefer to wait for things to be fixed. That sounds like patience to me.... not lack of it.


Furthermore, how is a failed launch that upsets players and causes a loss in customer base helping them?
In the short term you may be correct... as it's the typical "money grabber" business scheme. Release early, market the hell out of it, offer initiatives to buy now, then take the fools for as much dough as possible before we crash and burn. In the long term however they end up in the exact same place you are suggesting they were in that caused early release in the first place.

While this isn't life or death for me, as a player, it may be for someone of the dev team. If this thing tanks, they are out of a job, and having no income can be a very serious issue, particularly in the current economical climate.

I can wait, but I know others can not, and will not. The only solution is that cryptic and/or atari need to get their **** together real damn fast, because it's THEIR butts on the line... not mine.

Oh and no, they are not a new start-up company. All the more reason why they should not be making these stupid mistakes. I'm not talking about the server being down either. I'm talking about a client that launches in 1 day, that is NOT ready for it. Why is it no one ever learns from their mistakes? Speaking of which, it's about time I learn from mine, and stop trying to debate this issue. The only thing it's accomplishing is ****ing me off to the point that I want to shoot someone. Screw that.
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